1
00:00:31,960 --> 00:00:34,960
But perhaps we'd better begin
at the best place for stories:

2
00:00:34,960 --> 00:00:36,960
at the beginning.

3
00:00:36,960 --> 00:00:37,960
'Five!'

4
00:00:37,960 --> 00:00:40,960
He was responsible
for aliens attacking the world.

5
00:00:41,960 --> 00:00:43,960
'Four!'

6
00:00:43,960 --> 00:00:45,960
He blew the moon
out of the Earth's orbit.

7
00:00:45,960 --> 00:00:47,960
'Three!'

8
00:00:47,960 --> 00:00:49,960
And he turned a bunch of puppets
into superstars.

9
00:00:49,960 --> 00:00:51,960
'Two!'

10
00:00:51,960 --> 00:00:52,960
He was a wonderful chap.

11
00:00:52,960 --> 00:00:55,960
One of the most honest chaps
I've ever met in my whole life.

12
00:00:55,960 --> 00:00:56,960
'One!'

13
00:00:56,960 --> 00:00:59,960
He's a very evil...
a very evil man.

14
00:01:02,960 --> 00:01:05,960
Ladies and gentlemen,
please welcome Gerry Anderson.

15
00:01:05,960 --> 00:01:07,960
APPLAUSE

16
00:01:40,960 --> 00:01:42,160
One has to bear in mind

17
00:01:42,160 --> 00:01:46,960
that I was always intensely
interested in space travel.

18
00:01:46,960 --> 00:01:48,960
I mean, I've always...

19
00:01:51,640 --> 00:01:55,960
..looked at the starry sky
and just wondered,

20
00:01:55,960 --> 00:01:57,800
what is out there?

21
00:01:57,800 --> 00:02:00,960
I remember, in fact, my brother,

22
00:02:00,960 --> 00:02:04,960
who was a Mosquito pilot
during the war,

23
00:02:04,960 --> 00:02:09,160
and I couldn't have been very old,
but he came back on leave once,

24
00:02:09,160 --> 00:02:14,960
and I remember very specifically
that he said to me once,

25
00:02:14,960 --> 00:02:19,960
"Assuming it were possible
to fly in a straight line

26
00:02:19,960 --> 00:02:21,960
"across the universe,

27
00:02:21,960 --> 00:02:25,480
"you must eventually come
to the end of the universe.

28
00:02:25,480 --> 00:02:26,960
"Or the edge of the universe.

29
00:02:26,960 --> 00:02:30,960
"And if so, what is beyond?"

30
00:02:30,960 --> 00:02:33,960
Well, of course,
that kind of mind-boggling question

31
00:02:33,960 --> 00:02:35,960
really set me thinking,

32
00:02:35,960 --> 00:02:37,960
and it's kept me going until today.

33
00:02:38,960 --> 00:02:40,960
My father, Gerry Anderson,

34
00:02:40,960 --> 00:02:43,960
produced 18 series
and four feature films,

35
00:02:43,960 --> 00:02:45,960
owned six Rolls-Royce motor cars,

36
00:02:45,960 --> 00:02:48,960
had four children,
across three marriages,

37
00:02:48,960 --> 00:02:50,960
and made and lost his fortune
twice over.

38
00:02:50,960 --> 00:02:52,960
But beyond these headlines,

39
00:02:52,960 --> 00:02:55,960
I actually know very little
about the man that I call Dad.

40
00:02:55,960 --> 00:02:57,960
What inspired him?

41
00:02:57,960 --> 00:03:00,960
Why was he never satisfied
with his work?

42
00:03:00,960 --> 00:03:03,960
Why were his relationships
so fractious?

43
00:03:03,960 --> 00:03:06,960
I've been loaned my very own FAB 1
to make a journey of discovery,

44
00:03:06,960 --> 00:03:09,480
visiting some of the key locations

45
00:03:09,480 --> 00:03:12,960
and speaking to some of his closest
family, friends, and colleagues,

46
00:03:12,960 --> 00:03:16,960
with the hope that I will finally be
able to understand what made the man

47
00:03:16,960 --> 00:03:20,000
who, for many,
made their childhoods.

48
00:03:20,000 --> 00:03:22,960
OK, Venus?
OK, Steve.

49
00:03:22,960 --> 00:03:24,960
Right, let's go.

50
00:03:29,960 --> 00:03:32,800
Very few people know
anything about my background.

51
00:03:32,800 --> 00:03:37,640
I don't once remember him telling me
about a happy childhood experience.

52
00:03:37,640 --> 00:03:40,960
I was in a house, an old house,
living right at the top,

53
00:03:40,960 --> 00:03:43,960
in one room, with my family.

54
00:03:43,960 --> 00:03:46,960
He spent a lot of time
drumming into me

55
00:03:46,960 --> 00:03:49,960
how poor his family were
when they grew up.

56
00:03:49,960 --> 00:03:52,960
Down below, we had a woman,
a very old lady,

57
00:03:52,960 --> 00:03:55,320
who used to bang on the ceiling
with her stick.

58
00:03:55,320 --> 00:03:57,960
It was Neasden, it was bleak.

59
00:03:57,960 --> 00:04:00,960
Opposite, we had a man -
I can't remember his name now -

60
00:04:00,960 --> 00:04:03,960
but he was just fresh out of jail.

61
00:04:03,960 --> 00:04:07,800
And on the bottom floor,
we had a mad artist

62
00:04:07,800 --> 00:04:09,640
and a prostitute.

63
00:04:09,640 --> 00:04:14,960
I think that Dad's climb
from the poverty of childhood

64
00:04:14,960 --> 00:04:19,000
was the most important endeavour
in his life.

65
00:04:19,000 --> 00:04:21,960
It's only right
that a bloke should have ambition.

66
00:04:21,960 --> 00:04:27,960
But that constant drive for success
was probably quite damaging for him,

67
00:04:27,960 --> 00:04:30,800
because in his mind,
he never reached it.

68
00:04:30,800 --> 00:04:32,960
I always feel that I have failed.

69
00:04:32,960 --> 00:04:35,960
You know that failure
cannot be tolerated.

70
00:04:35,960 --> 00:04:38,960
I think Dad's drive to succeed

71
00:04:38,960 --> 00:04:42,000
was probably due to the way
he was brought up by his parents.

72
00:04:42,000 --> 00:04:46,960
And, I suppose,
the way that they were raised, too.

73
00:04:46,960 --> 00:04:51,160
First of all, dealing with my
grandparents on my father's side,

74
00:04:51,160 --> 00:04:52,960
they were Jewish.

75
00:04:52,960 --> 00:04:57,480
They came as immigrants
to this country.

76
00:04:57,480 --> 00:04:58,960
And when they arrived here,

77
00:04:58,960 --> 00:05:01,960
the immigration people said
to my grandfather, "Name?"

78
00:05:01,960 --> 00:05:03,640
And he said, "Bieloglovski."

79
00:05:03,640 --> 00:05:04,960
And the immigration officer said,

80
00:05:04,960 --> 00:05:07,960
"I can't possibly spell that.
Your name's Abrahams."

81
00:05:07,960 --> 00:05:09,480
And so that was his name.

82
00:05:09,480 --> 00:05:13,000
Now, on my mother's side,

83
00:05:13,000 --> 00:05:15,480
my grandmother lived in Hackney,

84
00:05:15,480 --> 00:05:19,960
and the family, that's on her side,

85
00:05:19,960 --> 00:05:22,640
all grew up to be very,
very Christian.

86
00:05:22,640 --> 00:05:24,960
Now, when I say Christian,
I don't mean they went to church,

87
00:05:24,960 --> 00:05:26,960
but I mean very English.

88
00:05:26,960 --> 00:05:28,960
It was...

89
00:05:28,960 --> 00:05:31,960
a tough place to be, as a child,

90
00:05:31,960 --> 00:05:35,800
between two parents
locked in battle.

91
00:05:35,800 --> 00:05:39,960
They had a lot of arguments,
and it wasn't a happy marriage.

92
00:05:39,960 --> 00:05:41,960
They should never have been married
in the first place,

93
00:05:41,960 --> 00:05:42,960
but there we are, they were.

94
00:05:42,960 --> 00:05:45,960
I loved Grandpa Joe,
he was a lovely man.

95
00:05:45,960 --> 00:05:49,640
But he wasn't for Grandma Debbie.
And she...

96
00:05:49,640 --> 00:05:53,960
She was very unhappy her whole life.

97
00:05:53,960 --> 00:05:59,960
My mother was kind of always
saying how she hated him,

98
00:05:59,960 --> 00:06:01,960
hated the marriage.

99
00:06:01,960 --> 00:06:03,960
But the mixture was explosive.

100
00:06:03,960 --> 00:06:05,960
Sometimes my father,
there would be a row going on,

101
00:06:05,960 --> 00:06:07,960
and she would say,
"I'm going to bed",

102
00:06:07,960 --> 00:06:10,960
and he would say, "No, you're not",
and he would lock the door.

103
00:06:10,960 --> 00:06:12,960
And I'd have to sit in a locked room
for maybe three hours

104
00:06:12,960 --> 00:06:15,960
while these two were going
hammer and tongs at each other.

105
00:06:15,960 --> 00:06:19,640
And consequently, I had just about

106
00:06:19,640 --> 00:06:22,960
the most miserable childhood
it's possible to imagine.

107
00:06:22,960 --> 00:06:25,960
I think it's inevitable
that Gerry's upbringing,

108
00:06:25,960 --> 00:06:29,960
and the struggles he had,
would feed into his work.

109
00:06:29,960 --> 00:06:32,320
Because, you know,
that's what all good creatives do.

110
00:06:32,320 --> 00:06:34,960
They take what they know
and put it into their work.

111
00:06:34,960 --> 00:06:36,960
Do you remember how it all started?

112
00:06:36,960 --> 00:06:39,960
I guess none of us
will ever forget that day.

113
00:06:39,960 --> 00:06:42,960
I was brought up, really,

114
00:06:42,960 --> 00:06:45,000
by a mother
who didn't want to be Jewish,

115
00:06:45,000 --> 00:06:47,960
didn't want to have anything
to do with the Jewish religion,

116
00:06:47,960 --> 00:06:50,480
and by my father, who was Jewish,

117
00:06:50,480 --> 00:06:54,160
and did want to have
a lot to do with religion.

118
00:06:54,160 --> 00:06:56,960
I think her...

119
00:06:57,960 --> 00:07:02,960
..her non-Jewish beliefs
actually extend far beyond that.

120
00:07:02,960 --> 00:07:06,960
Gerry's mother
was unbelievably anti-Semitic.

121
00:07:06,960 --> 00:07:08,960
One day,
this was just before the war,

122
00:07:08,960 --> 00:07:11,960
a laundry boy came
to collect the laundry,

123
00:07:11,960 --> 00:07:14,960
which was in a sheet tied up
with a list on it,

124
00:07:14,960 --> 00:07:17,960
and he took the laundry, very
cheerfully, "Thank you very much",

125
00:07:17,960 --> 00:07:20,160
and she walked back,

126
00:07:20,160 --> 00:07:23,960
perhaps to get the money for the
last week's laundry, I don't know,

127
00:07:23,960 --> 00:07:25,960
and he said, "Hold on a minute."

128
00:07:25,960 --> 00:07:27,960
He had seen the name Abrahams.

129
00:07:27,960 --> 00:07:30,960
And as she was returning,
he shouted out,

130
00:07:30,960 --> 00:07:33,480
"We don't take laundry from Jews."

131
00:07:33,480 --> 00:07:35,960
And he threw the laundry,
which hit her fair and square,

132
00:07:35,960 --> 00:07:36,960
and slammed the door.

133
00:07:38,000 --> 00:07:42,960
He was teased...
for having a Jewish surname.

134
00:07:42,960 --> 00:07:45,960
I also remember at Neasden,
going to school,

135
00:07:45,960 --> 00:07:50,960
and kids dancing in a circle
around me, saying "Jew boy".

136
00:07:50,960 --> 00:07:55,960
So I think he very quickly
developed feelings, as a kid,

137
00:07:55,960 --> 00:07:59,800
that religion was a thing
that only brought negativity.

138
00:07:59,800 --> 00:08:01,960
I don't really think
you'll find much, if any religion

139
00:08:01,960 --> 00:08:03,960
in any of the shows
because of that.

140
00:08:03,960 --> 00:08:06,960
So, with the aid of my mother,
I totally rebelled.

141
00:08:06,960 --> 00:08:10,960
So she,
after a considerable argument,

142
00:08:10,960 --> 00:08:14,960
forced my father to change
the family name by deed poll.

143
00:08:14,960 --> 00:08:17,960
I remember her saying,
"I always liked the name Anderson."

144
00:08:17,960 --> 00:08:19,960
I know that name.

145
00:08:19,960 --> 00:08:22,800
From everything I can tell,
from what he said,

146
00:08:22,800 --> 00:08:24,960
as a child,
he was very close to his mum,

147
00:08:24,960 --> 00:08:28,960
and actually, with hindsight,

148
00:08:28,960 --> 00:08:32,960
he can see that
she was quite a manipulator.

149
00:08:32,960 --> 00:08:35,960
And she never had a kind word
to say for anybody.

150
00:08:35,960 --> 00:08:40,960
I grew up, rightly or wrongly,
very, very much on my mother's side.

151
00:08:40,960 --> 00:08:45,800
So my father was the enemy,
and I was an ally to my mother.

152
00:08:45,800 --> 00:08:50,960
Therefore, I inherited all her ways,
and I hated his ways.

153
00:08:50,960 --> 00:08:54,960
He became a mummy's boy not because
Debbie was a wonderful mother,

154
00:08:54,960 --> 00:08:58,960
but because she set the stage

155
00:08:58,960 --> 00:09:05,320
for Joe being a useless,
ugly, lazy, slovenly man.

156
00:09:05,320 --> 00:09:07,960
My mother used to humiliate him.

157
00:09:07,960 --> 00:09:09,960
And, er...

158
00:09:09,960 --> 00:09:13,960
When I was a kid,
she used to say to me, jokingly,

159
00:09:13,960 --> 00:09:14,960
"Come on, you ugly devil,

160
00:09:14,960 --> 00:09:17,800
"you look more like your dad
every day of the week."

161
00:09:17,800 --> 00:09:19,640
It used to break my heart, you know.

162
00:09:19,640 --> 00:09:21,960
Because I was brought up to think
that my father was ugly.

163
00:09:21,960 --> 00:09:24,960
So when she would say that to me,
I used to get very upset about it.

164
00:09:24,960 --> 00:09:28,960
Gerry's relationship
with his father,

165
00:09:28,960 --> 00:09:33,640
I think only began to heal

166
00:09:33,640 --> 00:09:36,960
only a short time
before Joe's death.

167
00:09:36,960 --> 00:09:40,960
But it was almost too late,
because he was taken ill,

168
00:09:40,960 --> 00:09:42,960
he went into hospital,

169
00:09:42,960 --> 00:09:47,960
and I believe up until the day
he had his final heart attack,

170
00:09:47,960 --> 00:09:51,640
he was still waiting on Debbie
hand and foot.

171
00:09:51,640 --> 00:09:54,160
When I arrived,

172
00:09:54,160 --> 00:09:56,960
my mother was actually
talking to a neighbour

173
00:09:56,960 --> 00:09:59,320
about the pain she'd been having
in her stomach,

174
00:09:59,320 --> 00:10:01,960
and how she felt sick,
and all the rest of it.

175
00:10:01,960 --> 00:10:05,960
And my father came in
with a tray of tea.

176
00:10:05,960 --> 00:10:06,960
Tea, m'lady?

177
00:10:06,960 --> 00:10:08,960
Tea on the lawn.

178
00:10:09,960 --> 00:10:12,000
And he had just had a heart attack.

179
00:10:12,000 --> 00:10:16,960
And an ambulance arrived,
and he was taken to hospital.

180
00:10:16,960 --> 00:10:20,960
And it was just about when
Thunderbirds was due to premiere.

181
00:10:20,960 --> 00:10:23,000
And he was in hospital,
I think in Maidenhead,

182
00:10:23,000 --> 00:10:24,960
and Gerry was so proud,

183
00:10:24,960 --> 00:10:27,960
cos he managed to get
a television set into the ward.

184
00:10:27,960 --> 00:10:33,960
And he was semiconscious when
they wheeled over a television set

185
00:10:33,960 --> 00:10:38,480
for one of the first showings
of Thunderbirds.

186
00:10:38,480 --> 00:10:41,960
We're not really sure if he could
hear it, or see it properly,

187
00:10:41,960 --> 00:10:44,960
but we've got notes
that suggest how proud Joe was

188
00:10:44,960 --> 00:10:47,640
of what his son had achieved.

189
00:10:47,640 --> 00:10:48,960
It was very important to Gerry

190
00:10:48,960 --> 00:10:52,960
that Joe had seen him
hit the heights, as it were.

191
00:10:52,960 --> 00:10:55,960
Get some rest now, Dad.
I'll see you tomorrow.

192
00:10:55,960 --> 00:11:00,960
When he died, he said something
to me which was incomprehensible,

193
00:11:00,960 --> 00:11:02,960
and I said, "I can't understand."

194
00:11:02,960 --> 00:11:05,960
And he said it again, and I said,
"I can't understand."

195
00:11:05,960 --> 00:11:08,960
And he said, "Can I have a pencil?"

196
00:11:08,960 --> 00:11:10,960
And he...

197
00:11:11,960 --> 00:11:12,960
He wrote...

198
00:11:14,160 --> 00:11:16,960
"It all happened

199
00:11:16,960 --> 00:11:18,960
"because..."

200
00:11:19,960 --> 00:11:22,960
And he lapsed into unconsciousness.

201
00:11:22,960 --> 00:11:27,960
And I, to this day, never know
what it was he was going to write.

202
00:11:29,480 --> 00:11:31,800
He must have had a terrible life.

203
00:11:31,800 --> 00:11:33,960
Yeah, course, if I could live
my time over again,

204
00:11:33,960 --> 00:11:38,960
I would have been much closer
to my father than I was.

205
00:11:38,960 --> 00:11:40,960
Why did I wait so long?

206
00:11:40,960 --> 00:11:43,640
Oh, John, you didn't know.

207
00:11:43,640 --> 00:11:47,960
I just feel very sad now
at the way I treated him.

208
00:11:47,960 --> 00:11:51,960
And in fact,
that's a very interesting point.

209
00:11:51,960 --> 00:11:55,960
You will see few, if any,
"mother" figures

210
00:11:55,960 --> 00:11:59,000
in any of the work that Gerry did.

211
00:11:59,000 --> 00:12:00,960
Right, Father.
OK, Father.

212
00:12:00,960 --> 00:12:02,960
Sure thing, Dad.
Yeah, Father.

213
00:12:02,960 --> 00:12:03,960
What's happened, Father?

214
00:12:03,960 --> 00:12:05,960
My father is an honourable man.

215
00:12:05,960 --> 00:12:10,320
When my mother died, I had to try
to be a mother and a father to him.

216
00:12:10,320 --> 00:12:12,960
It's not as if you had a mother
to look after you,

217
00:12:12,960 --> 00:12:14,320
so don't let me down.

218
00:12:14,320 --> 00:12:19,640
I think the only happiness
he found in his childhood

219
00:12:19,640 --> 00:12:21,480
was with his brother.

220
00:12:21,480 --> 00:12:24,960
This older brother was
the only thing he looked up to,

221
00:12:24,960 --> 00:12:29,960
was the only thing that almost
made life worth living, I suppose.

222
00:12:29,960 --> 00:12:33,960
Lionel Anderson
was Gerry's older brother,

223
00:12:33,960 --> 00:12:36,960
older by, I think, seven years.

224
00:12:38,960 --> 00:12:39,960
Good-looking guy.

225
00:12:39,960 --> 00:12:42,960
Gerry absolutely idolised him.

226
00:12:42,960 --> 00:12:46,960
I think Lionel
was almost godlike to him.

227
00:12:46,960 --> 00:12:50,960
When the war broke out, I was 11,
and he was joining up,

228
00:12:50,960 --> 00:12:52,960
so I guess he was probably 18.

229
00:12:52,960 --> 00:12:56,960
It wasn't really until the war
that I used to see very much of him.

230
00:12:56,960 --> 00:12:58,960
I just have very strong
recollections

231
00:12:58,960 --> 00:13:00,800
from the things he did.

232
00:13:00,800 --> 00:13:04,960
I mean, during the Blitz, he was
Light Rescue, and so he was a hero.

233
00:13:04,960 --> 00:13:07,000
Lionel was a classic boy
growing up in the '30s,

234
00:13:07,000 --> 00:13:09,960
late '30s, early '40s.

235
00:13:09,960 --> 00:13:11,960
Loved everything to do with
aeroplanes,

236
00:13:11,960 --> 00:13:15,160
loved everything to do with speed,
transport.

237
00:13:15,160 --> 00:13:18,960
The opportunity
to join the Royal Air Force

238
00:13:18,960 --> 00:13:21,960
would have been something
that was massively exciting to him.

239
00:13:21,960 --> 00:13:24,800
Debbie doted on Lionel,

240
00:13:24,800 --> 00:13:29,960
clearly was much fonder of him
than she was of Gerry.

241
00:13:29,960 --> 00:13:32,960
You almost feel like
Gerry was an afterthought.

242
00:13:32,960 --> 00:13:36,320
So all of her focus and love,
you feel,

243
00:13:36,320 --> 00:13:39,960
is directed towards one person.

244
00:13:39,960 --> 00:13:41,960
Gerry mentioned his brother
numerous times.

245
00:13:41,960 --> 00:13:43,160
He was very proud of his brother

246
00:13:43,160 --> 00:13:45,000
and his contribution
to the Second World War.

247
00:13:45,000 --> 00:13:49,960
What happened was he was sent
to Arizona for his training.

248
00:13:49,960 --> 00:13:51,960
Cos you couldn't train over England,

249
00:13:51,960 --> 00:13:53,640
you'd be shot down
by German aircraft.

250
00:13:53,640 --> 00:13:57,960
So he was sent to Arizona,
to an airfield called Falcon Field.

251
00:13:57,960 --> 00:13:59,800
He was an inveterate letter writer.

252
00:13:59,800 --> 00:14:01,960
I'm sure Debbie read
and re-read and re-read them,

253
00:14:01,960 --> 00:14:04,960
and read them out loud to Gerry.

254
00:14:04,960 --> 00:14:06,960
And judging from his letters,

255
00:14:06,960 --> 00:14:08,960
he seems to have maintained

256
00:14:08,960 --> 00:14:13,960
a much more healthy relationship
with my parents than I did.

257
00:14:13,960 --> 00:14:16,960
Nothing I can see in the letters

258
00:14:16,960 --> 00:14:19,960
that suggests a close relationship
with his father.

259
00:14:19,960 --> 00:14:24,960
His mother, on the other hand,
is a totally different relationship.

260
00:14:24,960 --> 00:14:26,960
A very intense relationship.

261
00:14:26,960 --> 00:14:29,960
It probably wasn't
a healthy relationship.

262
00:14:29,960 --> 00:14:31,960
I think as a role model,

263
00:14:31,960 --> 00:14:33,960
Lionel would have been something

264
00:14:33,960 --> 00:14:37,960
that was almost impossible
for Gerry to live up to.

265
00:14:37,960 --> 00:14:40,960
I mean, if you've got a brother
who's flying an aircraft

266
00:14:40,960 --> 00:14:42,960
over Nazi-occupied Europe
every night,

267
00:14:42,960 --> 00:14:44,960
obviously one naturally
thought of him as a hero.

268
00:14:44,960 --> 00:14:47,800
Let's face it, he was a hero.
Like all of them.

269
00:14:47,800 --> 00:14:49,960
He's quite a guy.
Yeah.

270
00:14:49,960 --> 00:14:50,960
And that is a thing

271
00:14:50,960 --> 00:14:53,960
which I would hear him repeat
over and over and over.

272
00:14:53,960 --> 00:14:57,320
And he painted quite the picture
of this hero pilot.

273
00:14:57,320 --> 00:14:58,960
It felt very much

274
00:14:58,960 --> 00:15:02,000
like he was the most positive
influence in Dad's life.

275
00:15:02,000 --> 00:15:05,960
I think it was from Lionel that
he got the idea for Thunderbirds,

276
00:15:05,960 --> 00:15:08,320
or certainly the name
for Thunderbirds.

277
00:15:08,320 --> 00:15:11,960
Obviously Lionel's having
an opportunity to do things

278
00:15:11,960 --> 00:15:17,800
that Gerry could only dream about,
and yet his brother is achieving.

279
00:15:17,800 --> 00:15:20,000
I mean, Hollywood came to Lionel.

280
00:15:20,000 --> 00:15:22,800
He was at Falcon Field

281
00:15:22,800 --> 00:15:26,320
when an American film crew,
producer, turned up

282
00:15:26,320 --> 00:15:27,960
to shoot a film,

283
00:15:27,960 --> 00:15:31,000
and it involved some of
the big actors at the time.

284
00:15:31,000 --> 00:15:33,960
He danced with Gene Tierney
when they had a party there.

285
00:15:33,960 --> 00:15:36,960
And there was another Hollywood star
called Preston Foster

286
00:15:36,960 --> 00:15:38,160
that he wrote about.

287
00:15:38,160 --> 00:15:42,000
All of the cadets are actually
brought into the film

288
00:15:42,000 --> 00:15:45,960
to parade, to march past, to be
in group scenes, what have you,

289
00:15:45,960 --> 00:15:49,960
and they can clearly see that
they're actually in this film.

290
00:15:49,960 --> 00:15:52,320
And the name of that film will be
very familiar to everyone,

291
00:15:52,320 --> 00:15:55,960
because the film was called
Thunder Birds.

292
00:15:58,960 --> 00:16:01,960
Cor, so that explains it!

293
00:16:01,960 --> 00:16:07,960
It must have been a huge blow to him
when Lionel, you know,

294
00:16:07,960 --> 00:16:09,000
died.

295
00:16:09,000 --> 00:16:12,960
After his squadron
converted to flying the Mosquito,

296
00:16:12,960 --> 00:16:14,960
they also changed roles,

297
00:16:14,960 --> 00:16:17,960
and his role now
was as an Intruder pilot.

298
00:16:17,960 --> 00:16:23,960
And what that meant was that they
flew ahead of the bomber stream

299
00:16:23,960 --> 00:16:27,320
to shoot up German night fighter
stations.

300
00:16:27,320 --> 00:16:28,960
Every morning when the postman came,

301
00:16:28,960 --> 00:16:32,640
it was just the dread of receiving
the telegram. Which finally came.

302
00:16:32,640 --> 00:16:35,960
And it was while
on one of those Intruder sorties

303
00:16:35,960 --> 00:16:38,640
that, sadly, Lionel was shot down.

304
00:16:42,960 --> 00:16:45,320
"The Air Ministry regret to report

305
00:16:45,320 --> 00:16:47,960
"that your son,
Lionel David Anderson,

306
00:16:47,960 --> 00:16:51,960
"failed to return from an operation
over enemy territory

307
00:16:51,960 --> 00:16:53,960
"and has been posted as missing."

308
00:16:53,960 --> 00:16:56,960
It would have been
absolutely catastrophic.

309
00:16:56,960 --> 00:16:59,960
Because although there would have
been an element of hope,

310
00:16:59,960 --> 00:17:03,000
the reality is, though,
that word "missing"

311
00:17:03,000 --> 00:17:06,800
invariably meant "dead."

312
00:17:06,800 --> 00:17:08,800
He didn't make it.

313
00:17:08,800 --> 00:17:10,960
He just didn't make it.

314
00:17:10,960 --> 00:17:13,960
My mother was
a very emotional person,

315
00:17:13,960 --> 00:17:15,960
and, er...

316
00:17:15,960 --> 00:17:19,960
she tended to wear her heart
on her sleeve.

317
00:17:19,960 --> 00:17:21,960
I'm aware, anecdotally,

318
00:17:21,960 --> 00:17:24,960
that Debbie is purported
to have said...

319
00:17:24,960 --> 00:17:26,960
"It should have been you.

320
00:17:26,960 --> 00:17:28,960
"Why was it Lionel?
It should have been you."

321
00:17:28,960 --> 00:17:31,960
And I think if we add that
to the fact

322
00:17:31,960 --> 00:17:35,960
that she created nigh on a shrine
for Lionel,

323
00:17:35,960 --> 00:17:37,960
with this portrait
that used to hang,

324
00:17:37,960 --> 00:17:40,960
and she would show everyone
who came around,

325
00:17:40,960 --> 00:17:43,960
I think there's a lot of credibility
to that story.

326
00:17:43,960 --> 00:17:47,960
You wouldn't forget something that
a parent had said to you like that.

327
00:17:47,960 --> 00:17:51,960
Well, my brother - and I'm quite
serious when I say this -

328
00:17:51,960 --> 00:17:53,000
he really should have lived,

329
00:17:53,000 --> 00:17:54,960
and I should have been the one
that was killed.

330
00:17:54,960 --> 00:17:57,960
And I just feel that, really,
he was more suited

331
00:17:57,960 --> 00:18:00,960
to go through this life than I was.

332
00:18:00,960 --> 00:18:02,960
And I would happily
have swapped places with him.

333
00:18:05,960 --> 00:18:08,960
I think if you look back
on the episodes of his shows,

334
00:18:08,960 --> 00:18:13,960
you'll find that there are always
strong characters who are pilots.

335
00:18:13,960 --> 00:18:17,000
I think the action figures,
with Mike Mercury,

336
00:18:17,000 --> 00:18:19,960
with Scott, and with Virgil,
to a degree,

337
00:18:19,960 --> 00:18:22,960
I think these
are all hero characters

338
00:18:22,960 --> 00:18:27,960
who probably embody certain elements
of Lionel in them.

339
00:18:27,960 --> 00:18:30,480
You saved our lives.
I'm glad we could help.

340
00:18:30,480 --> 00:18:31,960
All I know is somewhere out there,

341
00:18:31,960 --> 00:18:33,960
there's a living creature
in distress.

342
00:18:33,960 --> 00:18:35,480
I can't let that call go unanswered.

343
00:18:35,480 --> 00:18:37,960
Before his death,
Lionel wrote a letter home

344
00:18:37,960 --> 00:18:39,000
in which he joked with Dad

345
00:18:39,000 --> 00:18:42,480
about wanting him to do well
in school and make lots of money,

346
00:18:42,480 --> 00:18:44,960
so he could look after Lionel
when he returned.

347
00:18:44,960 --> 00:18:48,960
But for various reasons, that
wasn't really an option for Dad.

348
00:18:48,960 --> 00:18:51,960
I was never gonna become anything
at secondary school.

349
00:18:51,960 --> 00:18:56,960
I'd like to think I had flair,
and certainly common sense,

350
00:18:56,960 --> 00:18:58,960
but in terms
of academic qualifications,

351
00:18:58,960 --> 00:19:02,160
I was just, you know,
like a barrow boy.

352
00:19:02,160 --> 00:19:06,960
He was not a fan of school at all.

353
00:19:06,960 --> 00:19:08,960
I don't think he took
his education seriously.

354
00:19:08,960 --> 00:19:11,320
I think his schooling
had been pretty poor,

355
00:19:11,320 --> 00:19:14,960
had been pretty broken up, because
he was evacuated in the war.

356
00:19:14,960 --> 00:19:18,960
Dragged off with Debbie with,
you know, "I'm leaving Joe again"

357
00:19:18,960 --> 00:19:20,960
and all the rest of it.

358
00:19:20,960 --> 00:19:23,960
He had trouble reading and writing,
which he later claimed was dyslexia,

359
00:19:23,960 --> 00:19:26,960
although I think
it's probably just poor education.

360
00:19:26,960 --> 00:19:30,960
His handwriting was... not great.

361
00:19:30,960 --> 00:19:33,960
But he always tried his best
to cover for it.

362
00:19:33,960 --> 00:19:37,960
He didn't want people to know
that he was ill-educated,

363
00:19:37,960 --> 00:19:40,960
or, you know, had trouble
with reading and writing.

364
00:19:40,960 --> 00:19:45,480
He had wanted to be
a fibrous plasterer.

365
00:19:45,480 --> 00:19:47,960
When I say plastering,
this was ornamental plastering,

366
00:19:47,960 --> 00:19:49,480
not plastering walls.

367
00:19:49,480 --> 00:19:52,960
And I really excelled,
and I was top of the class.

368
00:19:52,960 --> 00:19:56,960
And so, obviously,
I was going to become a plasterer.

369
00:19:56,960 --> 00:19:58,960
And who uses plasterers?

370
00:19:58,960 --> 00:20:00,960
The answer is, film studios.

371
00:20:00,960 --> 00:20:02,960
Oh, films?

372
00:20:02,960 --> 00:20:05,960
Oh, that must be
a very exciting life.

373
00:20:05,960 --> 00:20:08,960
Very soon after he started
this training in plastering,

374
00:20:08,960 --> 00:20:12,960
he was having terrible rashes
and skin peeling up his forearms.

375
00:20:12,960 --> 00:20:15,160
And it turned out
it gave him dermatitis.

376
00:20:15,160 --> 00:20:17,960
It was really horrible,
and the doctor said,

377
00:20:17,960 --> 00:20:20,960
"Well, it's obviously the lime
and the plaster that's causing this,

378
00:20:20,960 --> 00:20:23,480
"and there's no way
that you can become a plasterer."

379
00:20:23,480 --> 00:20:26,960
Well, I had already set my heart
on studios, films.

380
00:20:26,960 --> 00:20:28,960
I really knew nothing about it.

381
00:20:28,960 --> 00:20:30,960
And I spent a very, very long time

382
00:20:30,960 --> 00:20:32,960
walking around
from studio to studio,

383
00:20:32,960 --> 00:20:36,960
saying to the gate men,
"Are there any jobs going?"

384
00:20:36,960 --> 00:20:40,960
And this was obviously
the start of everything.

385
00:20:40,960 --> 00:20:46,160
My father, through a relative
of a relative of a relative,

386
00:20:46,160 --> 00:20:51,960
knew Sidney Bernstein,
who was chairman of Granada.

387
00:20:51,960 --> 00:20:55,960
And he managed to get me
an interview with the great man.

388
00:20:55,960 --> 00:20:58,960
And I went along, and he said,
"What do you want to be?"

389
00:20:58,960 --> 00:21:00,960
And I said, "A cameraman."

390
00:21:00,960 --> 00:21:04,960
And he said, "Well, look,
everybody wants to be a cameraman.

391
00:21:04,960 --> 00:21:06,960
"I'm going to put a date
in my diary.

392
00:21:06,960 --> 00:21:08,960
"If you come back
in six months' time

393
00:21:08,960 --> 00:21:11,640
"and tell me that you still
want to become a cameraman,

394
00:21:11,640 --> 00:21:13,960
"I will give you a job
on a camera crew."

395
00:21:13,960 --> 00:21:16,480
Dad was never hugely patient.

396
00:21:16,480 --> 00:21:19,960
What I remember very clearly
is when he said "six months' time",

397
00:21:19,960 --> 00:21:23,480
he might as well have said
"45 years' time".

398
00:21:23,480 --> 00:21:26,960
It seemed such a huge amount of time
to wait.

399
00:21:26,960 --> 00:21:32,000
So I came out and just dismissed
him and the interview from my mind,

400
00:21:32,000 --> 00:21:34,960
and I thought,
"If I'm gonna be a cameraman,

401
00:21:34,960 --> 00:21:37,640
"I might as well do
something to do with photography."

402
00:21:37,640 --> 00:21:41,960
So I walked into Regent Studios,
on Regent Street,

403
00:21:41,960 --> 00:21:43,960
which is a little passport studio,

404
00:21:43,960 --> 00:21:46,960
and I was a developist.

405
00:21:46,960 --> 00:21:48,960
He then managed to get a job

406
00:21:48,960 --> 00:21:54,000
with the Ministry of Information's
Colonial Film Unit.

407
00:21:54,000 --> 00:21:58,960
And I did, as a trainee, projection,

408
00:21:58,960 --> 00:22:02,160
and camera crew, and editing,
and so on.

409
00:22:02,160 --> 00:22:06,480
And so I decided that I would work
in the cutting room.

410
00:22:06,480 --> 00:22:09,960
And from there, I heard that
there was a vacancy going

411
00:22:09,960 --> 00:22:11,960
in Gainsborough Pictures.

412
00:22:11,960 --> 00:22:13,960
FANFARE

413
00:22:13,960 --> 00:22:17,960
And so that's how
I really came to be

414
00:22:17,960 --> 00:22:21,960
a member
of the British film business.

415
00:22:21,960 --> 00:22:25,960
In the late 1940s, I think 1947,

416
00:22:25,960 --> 00:22:28,960
he was called up to the RAF.

417
00:22:28,960 --> 00:22:31,000
The joining up of the RAF

418
00:22:31,000 --> 00:22:33,960
was something which
he had been dreading,

419
00:22:33,960 --> 00:22:35,960
because he was such a mummy's boy.

420
00:22:35,960 --> 00:22:38,960
When I finished my initial training,

421
00:22:38,960 --> 00:22:41,960
we took a so-called
intelligence test,

422
00:22:41,960 --> 00:22:46,960
and I was then interviewed
by the education officer,

423
00:22:46,960 --> 00:22:48,640
and he said,

424
00:22:48,640 --> 00:22:52,960
"Well, you have very,
very low marks.

425
00:22:52,960 --> 00:22:55,960
"In fact, so low,
that we can only offer you

426
00:22:55,960 --> 00:22:58,960
"either general duties
in the cookhouse..."

427
00:22:58,960 --> 00:23:01,960
If I cooked like you,
I wouldn't shout about it neither.

428
00:23:01,960 --> 00:23:04,960
"..or military police."

429
00:23:04,960 --> 00:23:07,960
Which says something
for the military police.

430
00:23:07,960 --> 00:23:09,960
He said, "What did you do
on civvy street?"

431
00:23:09,960 --> 00:23:12,960
And I told him I was
an assistant film editor,

432
00:23:12,960 --> 00:23:15,960
and I could see he was
quite startled by that.

433
00:23:15,960 --> 00:23:18,960
And then he offered me
a so-called C-trade,

434
00:23:18,960 --> 00:23:21,960
which allowed me to become
a radiotelephone operator,

435
00:23:21,960 --> 00:23:23,960
which I did.

436
00:23:23,960 --> 00:23:28,960
Dad exited the RAF in 1949.

437
00:23:28,960 --> 00:23:30,960
With good grades across the board.

438
00:23:30,960 --> 00:23:32,960
So he must have been proud of that.

439
00:23:32,960 --> 00:23:33,960
We were very fortunate, really,

440
00:23:33,960 --> 00:23:36,960
because people who were called up
for National Service

441
00:23:36,960 --> 00:23:41,960
had to be reinstated in the job
they held when they left.

442
00:23:41,960 --> 00:23:47,480
And so when I came out,
I was sent to Pinewood Studios.

443
00:23:47,480 --> 00:23:49,960
And he very quickly
rose through the ranks,

444
00:23:49,960 --> 00:23:53,960
from sound editor, to assistant
film editor, to film editor.

445
00:23:53,960 --> 00:23:56,960
He also met Betty Wrightman,
who he soon married.

446
00:23:56,960 --> 00:24:01,960
And they quite quickly had Linda,
first daughter,

447
00:24:01,960 --> 00:24:05,960
and then quite soon after that,
Joy, second daughter.

448
00:24:05,960 --> 00:24:07,960
After being jettisoned from the RAF,

449
00:24:07,960 --> 00:24:10,960
his personal life and his career
seemed to be taking off.

450
00:24:10,960 --> 00:24:13,960
After a couple of years, he found
himself working for a company

451
00:24:13,960 --> 00:24:16,960
called Polytechnic Films,
where he was appointed director

452
00:24:16,960 --> 00:24:18,960
on a series called
You've Never Seen This,

453
00:24:18,960 --> 00:24:20,960
which, ironically, was never seen.

454
00:24:20,960 --> 00:24:22,960
And it was whilst
working on that series

455
00:24:22,960 --> 00:24:25,960
that he met his future
business partner, Arthur Provis.

456
00:24:25,960 --> 00:24:28,960
And that's how we got together,
and we became very friendly.

457
00:24:28,960 --> 00:24:32,960
And so when that ill-fated series
came to an end,

458
00:24:32,960 --> 00:24:35,960
we said, "Why don't we start
our own production company?"

459
00:24:35,960 --> 00:24:37,960
Which we did.

460
00:24:37,960 --> 00:24:40,960
Hence AP Films,
Anderson and Provis.

461
00:24:40,960 --> 00:24:42,320
We got on very, very, well,

462
00:24:42,320 --> 00:24:45,000
and we took with us
some friends that we had met.

463
00:24:45,000 --> 00:24:46,960
Reg Hill, brilliant man.

464
00:24:46,960 --> 00:24:48,960
And John Read.

465
00:24:48,960 --> 00:24:53,960
We started the company,
and we needed a secretary.

466
00:24:53,960 --> 00:24:55,960
And there's a very interesting thing
here,

467
00:24:55,960 --> 00:24:59,960
because we advertised
for a part-time secretary.

468
00:24:59,960 --> 00:25:01,000
When you were growing up,

469
00:25:01,000 --> 00:25:04,960
what did you want to be
when you grew up?

470
00:25:04,960 --> 00:25:07,960
Er... I could say "famous."

471
00:25:07,960 --> 00:25:10,960
So we put an advert
in the local paper

472
00:25:10,960 --> 00:25:13,960
for a secretary for two days a week.

473
00:25:13,960 --> 00:25:17,320
I didn't know how to get into
the film business at all,

474
00:25:17,320 --> 00:25:20,960
and then one day, I saw an ad,
you know, in a newspaper,

475
00:25:20,960 --> 00:25:24,960
a small film company
looking for a Girl Friday.

476
00:25:24,960 --> 00:25:26,960
I thought, "Oh, I can do that."

477
00:25:26,960 --> 00:25:30,960
And I received a call,
in response to that advert,

478
00:25:30,960 --> 00:25:33,160
from a very jolly lady,

479
00:25:33,160 --> 00:25:36,960
who said,
"Yes, I can keep you all in order,

480
00:25:36,960 --> 00:25:40,960
"it sounds very interesting,
and I'd love to do it."

481
00:25:40,960 --> 00:25:43,640
And a couple of hours later,
my partner, Arthur Provis,

482
00:25:43,640 --> 00:25:46,640
received a call from Sylvia Thamm.

483
00:25:46,640 --> 00:25:48,960
And then I got a call from them,
really desperate.

484
00:25:48,960 --> 00:25:51,000
And, er...

485
00:25:51,000 --> 00:25:53,960
So, at the end of the day, I said,

486
00:25:53,960 --> 00:25:56,960
"I think the lady who called me
would be ideal."

487
00:25:56,960 --> 00:25:59,960
And he said, "The lady who called me
was wonderful,

488
00:25:59,960 --> 00:26:02,160
"I'm sure she'd be right."

489
00:26:02,160 --> 00:26:04,960
And we got on very well, so we said,
"Let's not argue about it,"

490
00:26:04,960 --> 00:26:08,960
so we flipped a coin,
and Sylvia got the job.

491
00:26:08,960 --> 00:26:14,000
Right from the word go,
she meant to have Gerry.

492
00:26:14,000 --> 00:26:16,960
And I mean, I liked her.
I was very intrigued by her,

493
00:26:16,960 --> 00:26:17,960
because she had been divorced twice,

494
00:26:17,960 --> 00:26:20,960
and I'd never met anybody
who'd been divorced even once.

495
00:26:20,960 --> 00:26:21,960
And I was very naive.

496
00:26:21,960 --> 00:26:24,960
And I have wondered,
on many occasions,

497
00:26:24,960 --> 00:26:27,960
had that coin
landed the other way up,

498
00:26:27,960 --> 00:26:30,960
things would be very different
today.

499
00:26:30,960 --> 00:26:32,960
You feeling regret?

500
00:26:32,960 --> 00:26:36,960
No, no. Just curious.

501
00:26:36,960 --> 00:26:40,960
The company really just sat dormant,

502
00:26:40,960 --> 00:26:44,960
with its telephones and notepaper
and filing cabinet,

503
00:26:44,960 --> 00:26:47,960
empty filing cabinet,
waiting for the phone to ring.

504
00:26:47,960 --> 00:26:50,960
I thought, naively,
that people would ring and say,

505
00:26:50,960 --> 00:26:53,960
"Good morning,
I'd like to order some films.

506
00:26:53,960 --> 00:26:56,480
"So, we'd like one feature film,
three commercials

507
00:26:56,480 --> 00:26:57,960
"and two documentaries."

508
00:26:57,960 --> 00:27:01,960
Before you know it, Dr Beaker,
you'll be filming in Hollywood.

509
00:27:01,960 --> 00:27:03,960
Of course, that didn't happen.

510
00:27:03,960 --> 00:27:05,960
I think we made a commercial
for Little Noddy.

511
00:27:05,960 --> 00:27:07,960
For one of the Ricicles.

512
00:27:07,960 --> 00:27:10,960
Hello, children.
It's me, Little Noddy.

513
00:27:10,960 --> 00:27:11,960
We were sort of scratching around,

514
00:27:11,960 --> 00:27:14,960
thinking,
"My God, the phone's not ringing."

515
00:27:14,960 --> 00:27:17,960
But finally, and just as we were
about to close the company,

516
00:27:17,960 --> 00:27:21,960
a woman by the name of Roberta Leigh
turned up on the doorstep.

517
00:27:21,960 --> 00:27:25,000
Who was driving a Rolls-Royce,
and she had the chauffeur,

518
00:27:25,000 --> 00:27:27,000
and she sort of swanned in

519
00:27:27,000 --> 00:27:30,960
and announced herself,
that she was a children's author.

520
00:27:30,960 --> 00:27:33,960
And said she'd heard
we'd made some puppet commercials,

521
00:27:33,960 --> 00:27:35,960
and she'd got this idea
called Twizzle,

522
00:27:35,960 --> 00:27:37,960
and were we interested?

523
00:27:37,960 --> 00:27:39,960
So that's basically how we met.

524
00:27:39,960 --> 00:27:42,960
He was desperate to get a job
when he came to me.

525
00:27:42,960 --> 00:27:44,960
He'd made a Noddy commercial.

526
00:27:45,960 --> 00:27:49,160
She was a rich lady,
and a bit out of our league, really.

527
00:27:49,160 --> 00:27:51,960
And they couldn't get started.

528
00:27:51,960 --> 00:27:53,960
Roberta was quite difficult
to deal with.

529
00:27:53,960 --> 00:27:54,960
And we found later

530
00:27:54,960 --> 00:27:58,160
that she was going around
to all the different companies

531
00:27:58,160 --> 00:27:59,960
and getting the cheapest quote.

532
00:27:59,960 --> 00:28:03,480
And that's how we were introduced
into the world of puppetry.

533
00:28:03,480 --> 00:28:06,960
I mean, I can't tell you
how upset I was,

534
00:28:06,960 --> 00:28:09,960
you know,
to be making bloody puppet films.

535
00:28:09,960 --> 00:28:12,960
Hey, manners, manners!

536
00:28:12,960 --> 00:28:15,960
But they turned out
to be his fortune.

537
00:28:15,960 --> 00:28:18,160
And it was actually at that point
that he started to make...

538
00:28:18,160 --> 00:28:20,960
real technical advances,

539
00:28:20,960 --> 00:28:24,960
because he was so embarrassed
by puppets.

540
00:28:24,960 --> 00:28:27,960
And then he got offered
another puppet series.

541
00:28:27,960 --> 00:28:30,960
Gerry Anderson,
him and I were like brothers.

542
00:28:30,960 --> 00:28:34,960
We even shared a car at one stage,
when we couldn't afford two.

543
00:28:34,960 --> 00:28:36,960
And, er...

544
00:28:36,960 --> 00:28:38,960
He was a wonderful chap.

545
00:28:38,960 --> 00:28:41,000
One of the most honest chaps
I've ever met in my life.

546
00:28:41,000 --> 00:28:44,960
I don't know if there was
any specific moment

547
00:28:44,960 --> 00:28:46,960
that the relationship ended.

548
00:28:46,960 --> 00:28:52,960
But as time went on,
that started to fray a little.

549
00:28:52,960 --> 00:28:55,960
Not because of any fallings out.

550
00:28:55,960 --> 00:28:59,960
Gerry says it was because he wanted
to buy the place we were in

551
00:28:59,960 --> 00:29:01,960
for some amazing amount of money,
and I didn't agree with it.

552
00:29:01,960 --> 00:29:03,960
He's convinced that was the reason.

553
00:29:03,960 --> 00:29:05,960
I don't think
that was entirely the reason.

554
00:29:05,960 --> 00:29:10,320
Dad wanted to push forward
and do bigger and better things,

555
00:29:10,320 --> 00:29:12,960
and make more technical advances.

556
00:29:12,960 --> 00:29:15,960
And there was a lot of risk
involved in that.

557
00:29:15,960 --> 00:29:17,960
They were two different people.

558
00:29:17,960 --> 00:29:20,960
I was rather more careful
than Gerry. Gerry would have a go.

559
00:29:20,960 --> 00:29:22,960
And I tended to be careful.

560
00:29:22,960 --> 00:29:25,960
And it gradually made me
more and more nervous.

561
00:29:25,960 --> 00:29:27,960
Not a bit like Gerry.
He didn't want to do anything,

562
00:29:27,960 --> 00:29:30,960
and Gerry wanted to go all in.

563
00:29:30,960 --> 00:29:32,960
I thought we'd get ourselves
into a lot of trouble.

564
00:29:32,960 --> 00:29:35,960
When we made Four Feather Falls,

565
00:29:35,960 --> 00:29:40,160
this is where my relationship
with Sylvia developed

566
00:29:40,160 --> 00:29:42,320
and my marriage broke up.

567
00:29:42,320 --> 00:29:45,960
Arthur was horrified by the way
Gerry was carrying on with Sylvia

568
00:29:45,960 --> 00:29:47,960
when he had a wife and two babies.

569
00:29:47,960 --> 00:29:50,960
And I decided to go.

570
00:29:55,640 --> 00:30:01,960
Now, I was really ill-equipped
to have a serious relationship.

571
00:30:01,960 --> 00:30:05,960
She was, and is,
a very, very nice person.

572
00:30:05,960 --> 00:30:09,960
I personally don't think
that we were really suited.

573
00:30:09,960 --> 00:30:13,960
I think when he married Mum,
he hadn't matured emotionally.

574
00:30:13,960 --> 00:30:17,960
He hadn't left home, he hadn't had
girlfriends before my mum.

575
00:30:17,960 --> 00:30:19,960
They were kind of pushed into it,

576
00:30:19,960 --> 00:30:24,640
and it wouldn't have
run a long term,

577
00:30:24,640 --> 00:30:27,960
whatever had happened,
whether he had met Sylvia or not.

578
00:30:27,960 --> 00:30:29,960
It was doomed from the start.

579
00:30:29,960 --> 00:30:34,960
I certainly, today, I look back,
and think, "What an awful thing."

580
00:30:34,960 --> 00:30:35,960
If I could replay it,

581
00:30:35,960 --> 00:30:39,800
I certainly would never have
allowed it to happen again.

582
00:30:39,800 --> 00:30:40,960
It's too late now.

583
00:30:40,960 --> 00:30:42,960
Yeah.

584
00:30:42,960 --> 00:30:44,960
Too late.

585
00:30:44,960 --> 00:30:47,960
Joy and Linda had a tough time,

586
00:30:47,960 --> 00:30:50,960
because their parents separated
when they were both quite young.

587
00:30:50,960 --> 00:30:53,000
I never told anybody
who my father was.

588
00:30:53,000 --> 00:30:56,960
Sylvia was the new partner.

589
00:30:56,960 --> 00:31:00,960
She was not particularly sensitive
to our needs.

590
00:31:00,960 --> 00:31:03,960
Me and my sister
lived at home with Mum.

591
00:31:03,960 --> 00:31:07,320
And we used to go and see Daddy
once a fortnight.

592
00:31:07,320 --> 00:31:08,960
He came and picked us up.

593
00:31:08,960 --> 00:31:11,960
There's pictures of us
all together as a family,

594
00:31:11,960 --> 00:31:14,960
and it really is very constructed.

595
00:31:14,960 --> 00:31:18,960
When Gerry's first marriage failed,
he was quite young.

596
00:31:18,960 --> 00:31:23,960
And I think probably
he didn't realise

597
00:31:23,960 --> 00:31:26,960
how badly affected
the girls would be.

598
00:31:26,960 --> 00:31:30,640
We were sitting at the tea table
in the kitchen,

599
00:31:30,640 --> 00:31:34,960
and of course, by then,
we were used to him not being there.

600
00:31:34,960 --> 00:31:38,960
And Mum said, "There's something
I need to tell you.

601
00:31:38,960 --> 00:31:42,960
"Daddy and I
are going to get divorced."

602
00:31:42,960 --> 00:31:45,960
And I said, "Why?"

603
00:31:45,960 --> 00:31:49,160
Although it's bonkers, because
he hadn't been there for ages.

604
00:31:49,160 --> 00:31:53,000
So, Mummy said, "Well, Daddy
doesn't love Mummy any more."

605
00:31:53,000 --> 00:31:57,960
And I said, "Well, if he doesn't
love Mummy, then I don't love him."

606
00:31:58,960 --> 00:32:01,960
When we were kids, and we went
to spend the weekend with Daddy,

607
00:32:01,960 --> 00:32:05,160
I mean, the contrast was incredible.

608
00:32:05,160 --> 00:32:09,960
Because Mum was struggling.
She did three jobs.

609
00:32:09,960 --> 00:32:14,960
She was a secretary, she was a
seamstress, and she worked in a pub.

610
00:32:14,960 --> 00:32:18,000
He was picking us up in his Roller,
and she was doing three jobs.

611
00:32:18,000 --> 00:32:19,960
And then we'd go

612
00:32:19,960 --> 00:32:23,960
and have a completely different
lifestyle for two days.

613
00:32:23,960 --> 00:32:25,960
And, er...

614
00:32:25,960 --> 00:32:28,160
As the years went by,
we drifted apart.

615
00:32:28,160 --> 00:32:30,000
Erm...

616
00:32:35,960 --> 00:32:40,960
We just bec...
We just became estranged, I think.

617
00:32:40,960 --> 00:32:42,960
The great sadness is...

618
00:32:42,960 --> 00:32:44,960
that Dad...

619
00:32:44,960 --> 00:32:50,000
I don't think ever really conveyed
to any of them how he truly felt.

620
00:32:50,000 --> 00:32:54,640
He talked about it in private,
to very, very few people,

621
00:32:54,640 --> 00:32:57,320
that it was a great source
of regret to him

622
00:32:57,320 --> 00:33:00,960
that he was not able
to bring those kids up.

623
00:33:00,960 --> 00:33:07,480
I don't think Daddy had a very good
model for happy marriages.

624
00:33:07,480 --> 00:33:10,480
That's not what
he'd experienced growing up.

625
00:33:10,480 --> 00:33:14,800
I mean, they came back on the scene
later, which was nice.

626
00:33:14,800 --> 00:33:17,960
I was living in London
and a friend of mine came over,

627
00:33:17,960 --> 00:33:18,960
and she said to me,

628
00:33:18,960 --> 00:33:21,960
"Did you know your dad's on
at the Barbican tonight?"

629
00:33:21,960 --> 00:33:24,960
"Why don't I take you?
He's doing a book signing."

630
00:33:24,960 --> 00:33:29,960
And I said, "Oh, I don't know.
I haven't seen him for ages."

631
00:33:29,960 --> 00:33:31,000
And she said, "Oh, go on.

632
00:33:31,000 --> 00:33:34,960
"It's about time you two got
together", blah, blah, blah.

633
00:33:34,960 --> 00:33:39,960
So we went, and he did a talk,
and it was really interesting.

634
00:33:39,960 --> 00:33:42,960
Good evening.
Thank you for coming along tonight.

635
00:33:42,960 --> 00:33:44,960
And I was sitting
right in the front row,

636
00:33:44,960 --> 00:33:47,960
but I hadn't seen him for so long,
he didn't know what I looked like.

637
00:33:47,960 --> 00:33:49,960
So when we came out,

638
00:33:49,960 --> 00:33:53,960
everyone was queueing up
to get their books signed,

639
00:33:53,960 --> 00:33:56,960
and when I got to
the front of the queue,

640
00:33:56,960 --> 00:33:58,160
I gave him my book, and he said,

641
00:33:58,160 --> 00:34:00,960
"What would you like me
to write in your book?"

642
00:34:00,960 --> 00:34:04,000
And I said, "You could write,
'To Joy, love Dad.'"

643
00:34:04,000 --> 00:34:08,960
And, erm...
Which he nearly had a heart attack.

644
00:34:08,960 --> 00:34:11,960
Dad's failure to maintain
personal relationships

645
00:34:11,960 --> 00:34:14,480
began to impact
his professional life

646
00:34:14,480 --> 00:34:16,160
almost as soon as it had started.

647
00:34:16,160 --> 00:34:18,960
I didn't get along very well
with Roberta Leigh,

648
00:34:18,960 --> 00:34:19,960
and I didn't...

649
00:34:19,960 --> 00:34:22,960
You know, in fairness,
maybe she didn't like me either.

650
00:34:22,960 --> 00:34:25,960
He's a very evil... A very evil man.

651
00:34:25,960 --> 00:34:29,960
But I decided that we should
really do our own series now.

652
00:34:29,960 --> 00:34:32,000
Our position was precarious

653
00:34:32,000 --> 00:34:36,000
right up until the time
I met Lew Grade.

654
00:34:36,000 --> 00:34:38,960
We were going under.

655
00:34:38,960 --> 00:34:41,960
And we had made Four Feather Falls.

656
00:34:41,960 --> 00:34:43,960
And I remember,

657
00:34:43,960 --> 00:34:49,960
we sent the last completed film
to Granada by post.

658
00:34:49,960 --> 00:34:52,960
And back came a cheque,
the final payment.

659
00:34:52,960 --> 00:34:55,960
And we waited for somebody
from Granada to say,

660
00:34:55,960 --> 00:34:57,960
"Well, what are you going
to do next?"

661
00:34:57,960 --> 00:35:00,960
And I haven't heard from Granada
to this day!

662
00:35:00,960 --> 00:35:06,000
And Gerry and Reg had come up with
an idea, I think with Barry Gray,

663
00:35:06,000 --> 00:35:08,960
about a car
that could do everything.

664
00:35:08,960 --> 00:35:09,960
Which was Supercar.

665
00:35:09,960 --> 00:35:11,960
I was hoping that
somebody would say,

666
00:35:11,960 --> 00:35:14,480
"This is wonderful,
how much money do you want?"

667
00:35:14,480 --> 00:35:16,640
And of course, that didn't happen,

668
00:35:16,640 --> 00:35:20,960
and we, again,
were about to close our studio

669
00:35:20,960 --> 00:35:24,960
when a man by the name
of Connery Chappell came to see us

670
00:35:24,960 --> 00:35:29,320
and said, "I know a man
whose name is Lew Grade,

671
00:35:29,320 --> 00:35:31,000
"I'm sure he would be interested."

672
00:35:31,000 --> 00:35:32,960
And he made an appointment.

673
00:35:32,960 --> 00:35:36,320
So Gerry went up
and met with Lew Grade.

674
00:35:36,320 --> 00:35:38,960
And I showed him the brochure,
and I remember him looking at it,

675
00:35:38,960 --> 00:35:45,960
and he said, "Yeah, looks good.
How much is it going to cost?"

676
00:35:45,960 --> 00:35:48,960
Let's say it was something
like £3,000 an episode.

677
00:35:48,960 --> 00:35:52,960
I remember Lew slammed the desk
with his fist -

678
00:35:52,960 --> 00:35:55,320
I mean, it frightened
the living daylights out of me -

679
00:35:55,320 --> 00:35:57,960
and he said, "I can't possibly
afford that sort of money

680
00:35:57,960 --> 00:35:59,960
"for a children's show."

681
00:35:59,960 --> 00:36:02,960
And then I think he must have seen
that I looked very frightened,

682
00:36:02,960 --> 00:36:05,000
and so he then became very kind
and said,

683
00:36:05,000 --> 00:36:07,160
"Look, Gerry,
I tell you what you do.

684
00:36:07,160 --> 00:36:09,320
"Let me see, the time now
is five o'clock.

685
00:36:09,320 --> 00:36:10,960
"Go back to the studio,

686
00:36:10,960 --> 00:36:13,960
"come back tomorrow and tell me
you've cut that price in half,

687
00:36:13,960 --> 00:36:17,000
"and I'll give you a contract
for 26 shows."

688
00:36:17,000 --> 00:36:21,960
Well, I was in my car,
going back to Lew.

689
00:36:21,960 --> 00:36:25,960
I had failed.
We had cut a third off the budget.

690
00:36:25,960 --> 00:36:29,000
And I went up,
and I was nearly in tears.

691
00:36:29,000 --> 00:36:31,480
I'm sure I was smelling like
a polecat.

692
00:36:31,480 --> 00:36:34,000
I hadn't shaved, been up all night.

693
00:36:34,000 --> 00:36:36,960
And I said...

694
00:36:36,960 --> 00:36:38,960
I said, "I'm terribly sorry,

695
00:36:38,960 --> 00:36:42,960
"but there's no way
we can cut it in half.

696
00:36:42,960 --> 00:36:45,960
"But we've managed
to cut off a third."

697
00:36:45,960 --> 00:36:50,960
And Lew said,
"OK, you've got a deal."

698
00:36:50,960 --> 00:36:53,960
And on the strength of that,
we went into production.

699
00:36:53,960 --> 00:36:55,640
So, what are we waiting for?

700
00:36:55,640 --> 00:36:58,960
This is just the start of
a long, friendly relationship.

701
00:36:58,960 --> 00:37:03,960
We were probably the dot-com company
of the '60s.

702
00:37:03,960 --> 00:37:05,640
That's what we were there.

703
00:37:05,640 --> 00:37:09,960
Looking back, I think Gerry
was the king of hardware,

704
00:37:09,960 --> 00:37:13,960
and Sylvia
was the queen of software.

705
00:37:13,960 --> 00:37:16,480
At first, I lived with her.

706
00:37:16,480 --> 00:37:20,960
She owned a little, tiny cottage
in Bourne End,

707
00:37:20,960 --> 00:37:22,960
and I moved in with her there.

708
00:37:22,960 --> 00:37:24,960
And I think here, again,

709
00:37:24,960 --> 00:37:27,800
all that would be fitting
for me to say

710
00:37:27,800 --> 00:37:31,960
is that you can't marry somebody
unless there is something there.

711
00:37:31,960 --> 00:37:33,960
I mean, you don't meet somebody

712
00:37:33,960 --> 00:37:35,960
and say, "God, I hate you,
will you marry me?"

713
00:37:35,960 --> 00:37:38,800
There obviously was a time
where we got on very well,

714
00:37:38,800 --> 00:37:41,960
and I was very attracted to her.

715
00:37:41,960 --> 00:37:43,960
The marriage...

716
00:37:43,960 --> 00:37:48,960
started to get bumpy
shortly afterwards.

717
00:37:48,960 --> 00:37:51,960
It became progressively more bumpy.

718
00:37:51,960 --> 00:37:55,960
It became stormy.

719
00:37:55,960 --> 00:37:57,960
In the extreme.

720
00:37:57,960 --> 00:37:58,960
The storm's getting worse.

721
00:38:01,640 --> 00:38:04,960
It has to be stressed that
she has her story. This is mine.

722
00:38:07,960 --> 00:38:11,960
Sylvia wanted to get married
in Caxton Hall.

723
00:38:11,960 --> 00:38:13,960
Which was the grand venue

724
00:38:13,960 --> 00:38:17,960
for people who wanted to have
big, grand, flashy weddings.

725
00:38:17,960 --> 00:38:20,960
And I suppose it was the first time
I had realised

726
00:38:20,960 --> 00:38:23,960
that she was very keen on publicity.

727
00:38:23,960 --> 00:38:26,960
Certainly, all the photographs
you see of the two of them,

728
00:38:26,960 --> 00:38:29,960
she's kind of centre stage,

729
00:38:29,960 --> 00:38:32,960
and Gerry's looking maybe
slightly embarrassed,

730
00:38:32,960 --> 00:38:34,960
or rather that he'd
be somewhere else.

731
00:38:34,960 --> 00:38:41,160
Gerry was quite happy not receiving
the same sort of publicity.

732
00:38:41,160 --> 00:38:44,960
He really didn't want
to be in the public eye.

733
00:38:44,960 --> 00:38:47,960
And obviously that caused tension.

734
00:38:47,960 --> 00:38:52,960
She was, and could have been,
an incredible help to me.

735
00:38:52,960 --> 00:38:54,960
She helped me by reading scripts.

736
00:38:54,960 --> 00:38:57,480
I used to dictate the scripts
to her.

737
00:38:57,480 --> 00:38:59,960
On Thunderbirds, I dictated
the whole script straight off.

738
00:38:59,960 --> 00:39:01,960
From the time I can remember,

739
00:39:01,960 --> 00:39:06,960
he had a... either an Amstrad
or a Peacock computer,

740
00:39:06,960 --> 00:39:09,800
which had a 25 MB hard drive.

741
00:39:09,800 --> 00:39:13,320
And he would sit at it and type.

742
00:39:13,320 --> 00:39:15,320
Gerry was a one-finger typer.

743
00:39:15,320 --> 00:39:17,960
A slow and painful process.

744
00:39:17,960 --> 00:39:21,960
When he was writing a script, he
would quite often either dictate it

745
00:39:21,960 --> 00:39:23,960
and I would take it down on paper,

746
00:39:23,960 --> 00:39:26,960
or I would type it straight
as he was dictating it.

747
00:39:26,960 --> 00:39:30,960
I was just the mechanism
to get it onto the paper.

748
00:39:30,960 --> 00:39:32,960
He'd always dictated his scripts,
I think.

749
00:39:32,960 --> 00:39:35,960
And I remember to this day,
we were sitting on the balcony

750
00:39:35,960 --> 00:39:37,960
of our apartment in Albufeira,

751
00:39:37,960 --> 00:39:39,960
and I said,
"There is one more thing,

752
00:39:39,960 --> 00:39:42,960
"right on the front,
'by Gerry and Sylvia Anderson.'"

753
00:39:42,960 --> 00:39:44,960
A thing I've always regretted.

754
00:39:44,960 --> 00:39:46,960
Because it wasn't
by Gerry and Sylvia Anderson.

755
00:39:46,960 --> 00:39:49,960
When it came to the nitty-gritty

756
00:39:49,960 --> 00:39:52,960
and the sweat of scripting
until the early hours,

757
00:39:52,960 --> 00:39:53,960
you know, when things were wrong,

758
00:39:53,960 --> 00:39:56,000
no, she wasn't there.

759
00:39:56,000 --> 00:39:58,960
The way we worked,
Gerry had the ideas,

760
00:39:58,960 --> 00:40:01,160
the adventure, the Boys' Own
adventure, if you like,

761
00:40:01,160 --> 00:40:02,960
and the idea for the...

762
00:40:02,960 --> 00:40:05,960
And later on,
obviously we met with our team,

763
00:40:05,960 --> 00:40:07,960
and they came up with ideas.

764
00:40:07,960 --> 00:40:10,960
A husband-and-wife team,
that was invented by the media.

765
00:40:10,960 --> 00:40:12,960
There were four directors.

766
00:40:12,960 --> 00:40:16,960
Myself, Reg Hill, Sylvia
and John Read.

767
00:40:16,960 --> 00:40:18,960
The team was four people.

768
00:40:18,960 --> 00:40:21,960
But he was the creative force.

769
00:40:21,960 --> 00:40:24,960
He was the one with the vision,
is what we all thought.

770
00:40:24,960 --> 00:40:28,960
I think that I've always had
a sort of a storehouse

771
00:40:28,960 --> 00:40:30,960
of unconnected ideas,

772
00:40:30,960 --> 00:40:32,960
and if somebody says,

773
00:40:32,960 --> 00:40:36,960
"Look, I want a script
for a new series a week from now,"

774
00:40:36,960 --> 00:40:39,960
it's a question of getting
all these latent ideas out

775
00:40:39,960 --> 00:40:42,960
and putting them together
and making a new show.

776
00:40:42,960 --> 00:40:46,960
The idea for Thunderbirds
really came to me

777
00:40:46,960 --> 00:40:49,960
as a result
of a German mine disaster

778
00:40:49,960 --> 00:40:52,960
which happened in 1963.

779
00:40:52,960 --> 00:40:57,960
What happened was
that the mine was flooded.

780
00:40:57,960 --> 00:41:01,960
A lake over the top suddenly
went straight down into the mine.

781
00:41:01,960 --> 00:41:05,320
And there were many miners
trapped in air pockets,

782
00:41:05,320 --> 00:41:08,960
some 1,000 feet below ground.

783
00:41:08,960 --> 00:41:12,960
And I avidly listened to
the news bulletins every day

784
00:41:12,960 --> 00:41:14,960
to hear the progress,

785
00:41:14,960 --> 00:41:16,960
and they were finally rescued.

786
00:41:16,960 --> 00:41:21,960
And so I started to think a rescue
story would be really great.

787
00:41:21,960 --> 00:41:25,960
Look, there are 600 people up there
with about 40 minutes to live.

788
00:41:25,960 --> 00:41:28,320
Now, you can't help them,
but I believe we can.

789
00:41:28,320 --> 00:41:31,960
If it were to be a rescue story
in a science fiction setting,

790
00:41:31,960 --> 00:41:35,960
then of course we had to have
some very modern aircraft.

791
00:41:35,960 --> 00:41:38,960
And so the series, you know,
was gradually formed.

792
00:41:38,960 --> 00:41:41,960
But who should take credit
for the shows

793
00:41:41,960 --> 00:41:43,960
became increasingly unclear
as time went on.

794
00:41:43,960 --> 00:41:46,960
Dad and Sylvia's memories of
the creative process seem to differ,

795
00:41:46,960 --> 00:41:48,960
and remain contentious to this day.

796
00:41:48,960 --> 00:41:49,960
Thunderbirds are go.

797
00:41:49,960 --> 00:41:51,960
I was at a press conference...

798
00:41:51,960 --> 00:41:53,640
Looks like the action's gonna start.

799
00:41:53,640 --> 00:41:55,960
..and everybody was
yattering away, and what a noise,

800
00:41:55,960 --> 00:41:57,960
and drinking,
and all the rest of it,

801
00:41:57,960 --> 00:41:59,320
and I'm talking to a guy
from the press,

802
00:41:59,320 --> 00:42:00,960
and she has a very piercing voice.

803
00:42:00,960 --> 00:42:02,960
You can hear it
from a long way away.

804
00:42:02,960 --> 00:42:04,960
And I heard her say,

805
00:42:04,960 --> 00:42:08,320
"Well, the way it works is
I sort of do all the creative work,

806
00:42:08,320 --> 00:42:10,480
"the characters, the scripting,
all the ideas,

807
00:42:10,480 --> 00:42:13,960
"and Gerry looks after the cameras,
that sort of thing."

808
00:42:13,960 --> 00:42:15,960
Well, I could have turned around
and...

809
00:42:15,960 --> 00:42:18,160
Can you imagine?
Can you just imagine?

810
00:42:18,160 --> 00:42:21,640
And I can see how that would have
been absolutely infuriating for him,

811
00:42:21,640 --> 00:42:23,800
because, as far as I can tell,

812
00:42:23,800 --> 00:42:24,960
almost every show idea

813
00:42:24,960 --> 00:42:27,960
was inspired by something
he had seen or experienced,

814
00:42:27,960 --> 00:42:30,960
or a particular technical
fascination that he had.

815
00:42:30,960 --> 00:42:33,960
I mean, obviously any show
is a huge collaborative effort,

816
00:42:33,960 --> 00:42:37,320
and some of those contributors will
have more influence than others,

817
00:42:37,320 --> 00:42:39,480
but it's all got to start somewhere.

818
00:42:40,960 --> 00:42:44,960
One of his great strengths
was seeing the value of people

819
00:42:44,960 --> 00:42:48,960
and being able to promote them,
or give them opportunities,

820
00:42:48,960 --> 00:42:51,960
which then fed into
the Gerry Anderson ethos

821
00:42:51,960 --> 00:42:53,960
of making the best possible
production.

822
00:42:53,960 --> 00:42:56,960
He was always keen on collaboration,
and he thrived on it,

823
00:42:56,960 --> 00:42:59,320
but I think if someone were to try
and take credit for his work,

824
00:42:59,320 --> 00:43:01,960
it would have just been too much
for him to bear.

825
00:43:01,960 --> 00:43:03,960
I think that most people
who are knowledgeable,

826
00:43:03,960 --> 00:43:05,960
and who are aware of the product,

827
00:43:05,960 --> 00:43:08,960
are aware of Sylvia's contribution.

828
00:43:08,960 --> 00:43:10,960
I do the characterisation.

829
00:43:10,960 --> 00:43:12,480
Gerry was an expert at what he did,

830
00:43:12,480 --> 00:43:14,640
and she was an expert
at what she did.

831
00:43:14,640 --> 00:43:19,800
She provided many human touches,
in costume and characterisation,

832
00:43:19,800 --> 00:43:21,960
in little touches of humour

833
00:43:21,960 --> 00:43:23,960
which might not have been
there otherwise.

834
00:43:23,960 --> 00:43:26,960
Her contribution
was pretty terrific.

835
00:43:26,960 --> 00:43:31,960
And the two of them combined was
a double whammy you couldn't stop.

836
00:43:31,960 --> 00:43:35,960
But unfortunately, life,
as it sometimes tends to do,

837
00:43:35,960 --> 00:43:39,480
gets in the way,
and gets up to its tricks.

838
00:43:39,480 --> 00:43:41,960
And it didn't work out.

839
00:43:41,960 --> 00:43:43,960
She was very talented,

840
00:43:43,960 --> 00:43:48,960
but she was very determined
about what she wanted.

841
00:43:48,960 --> 00:43:51,960
She was very media savvy.

842
00:43:51,960 --> 00:43:54,960
She was a very,
very attractive woman.

843
00:43:54,960 --> 00:43:57,960
And she could be very, very nice.

844
00:43:57,960 --> 00:44:01,960
When they had the premiere
for Thunderbirds,

845
00:44:01,960 --> 00:44:06,960
she had a dress made for me,
and it was absolutely beautiful.

846
00:44:06,960 --> 00:44:09,320
I feel that I was really
playing dressing up, really.

847
00:44:09,320 --> 00:44:12,800
It was playing with my dolls,
really.

848
00:44:12,800 --> 00:44:15,960
She had a way of getting round me,
if she wanted to.

849
00:44:15,960 --> 00:44:18,960
And she came into my room one day
and said, very sweet about it,

850
00:44:18,960 --> 00:44:22,960
"Gerry, can I please, please, please
play Lady Penelope?"

851
00:44:22,960 --> 00:44:25,960
I may not get another chance.
Please.

852
00:44:25,960 --> 00:44:28,960
And I said, "Well, no",
because I wanted...

853
00:44:28,960 --> 00:44:31,960
Fenella Fielding, was it?
I wanted her to play the part.

854
00:44:31,960 --> 00:44:35,960
And very often,
when I disagreed with her,

855
00:44:35,960 --> 00:44:38,960
life became very miserable
as a result.

856
00:44:38,960 --> 00:44:42,640
And when we had
these sort of terrible rows,

857
00:44:42,640 --> 00:44:46,800
she then had the capacity
to maybe hold a hand out,

858
00:44:46,800 --> 00:44:49,960
and we'd go to bed,
and it would all be marvellous.

859
00:44:49,960 --> 00:44:51,960
Eventually, I said OK.

860
00:44:51,960 --> 00:44:52,960
OK, Penny.

861
00:44:52,960 --> 00:44:55,960
He felt like,
"I've already made one mistake.

862
00:44:55,960 --> 00:44:57,960
"I don't want to make another one."

863
00:44:57,960 --> 00:45:01,960
So I think his relationship
with Sylvia

864
00:45:01,960 --> 00:45:05,320
became one of constantly doing
whatever was necessary

865
00:45:05,320 --> 00:45:07,160
to keep her happy.

866
00:45:07,160 --> 00:45:09,000
To keep her smiling.

867
00:45:09,000 --> 00:45:11,960
To help her further her career.

868
00:45:11,960 --> 00:45:16,480
And that was to his, I think,
personal detriment,

869
00:45:16,480 --> 00:45:19,960
and, eventually,
his professional detriment as well.

870
00:45:19,960 --> 00:45:22,480
But she was a tough cookie.

871
00:45:22,480 --> 00:45:26,960
She was so good as the character,
I forgive her everything.

872
00:45:26,960 --> 00:45:28,960
With the marriage falling apart,

873
00:45:28,960 --> 00:45:32,960
certainly from Dad's point of view,
anyway, in the mid-'60s,

874
00:45:32,960 --> 00:45:36,960
Sylvia broke the news to Dad
that she was pregnant.

875
00:45:36,960 --> 00:45:40,960
My immediate reaction was one of,
"Oh, God, I'm trapped."

876
00:45:40,960 --> 00:45:44,960
As I already was feeling that
"I've had enough of this."

877
00:45:44,960 --> 00:45:46,960
It's a boy!

878
00:45:46,960 --> 00:45:48,960
But once Gerry Jr arrived,

879
00:45:48,960 --> 00:45:50,960
I think he suddenly
found a connection.

880
00:45:50,960 --> 00:45:53,960
He was desperate to make up for
any failures he'd made as a father

881
00:45:53,960 --> 00:45:55,960
during his previous marriage.

882
00:45:55,960 --> 00:45:59,640
In terms of his parenting,
Dad was, of course, a workaholic,

883
00:45:59,640 --> 00:46:01,800
so he wasn't around that much.

884
00:46:01,800 --> 00:46:03,960
But it would be unfair to say
that he didn't care.

885
00:46:03,960 --> 00:46:05,480
He just showed it in unusual ways.

886
00:46:05,480 --> 00:46:08,320
Like constantly worrying about
his kids coming to physical harm.

887
00:46:08,320 --> 00:46:09,960
I think maybe it's a throwback

888
00:46:09,960 --> 00:46:11,960
to Lionel's death
while he was away from home,

889
00:46:11,960 --> 00:46:13,960
and the pain it inflicted
on his parents.

890
00:46:13,960 --> 00:46:15,960
And I think it meant
that he was always concerned

891
00:46:15,960 --> 00:46:18,960
that some harm may come to his
children if they were away from him.

892
00:46:18,960 --> 00:46:21,960
I went to him and I said,

893
00:46:21,960 --> 00:46:22,960
"We're going to France."

894
00:46:22,960 --> 00:46:25,320
And he just put the boot in

895
00:46:25,320 --> 00:46:27,960
and started coming out
with all this,

896
00:46:27,960 --> 00:46:30,960
"Well, what if the plane door
comes open?"

897
00:46:30,960 --> 00:46:33,320
I said, "Well,
we'll be sucked out, won't we?"

898
00:46:34,960 --> 00:46:37,960
And those fears and anxieties
were often manifested on screen,

899
00:46:37,960 --> 00:46:39,160
like in UFO.

900
00:46:39,160 --> 00:46:40,960
Dad!

901
00:46:40,960 --> 00:46:43,960
HORN BLARES, TYRES SCREECH

902
00:46:43,960 --> 00:46:45,960
Johnny!

903
00:46:45,960 --> 00:46:48,800
And the lead character, Ed Straker,

904
00:46:48,800 --> 00:46:50,960
is the head of a studio
with his marriage collapsing.

905
00:46:50,960 --> 00:46:53,960
It's Dad's art imitating Dad's life.

906
00:47:00,960 --> 00:47:03,000
It was fine
when we were all struggling,

907
00:47:03,000 --> 00:47:05,160
but once we got there, erm,

908
00:47:05,160 --> 00:47:09,960
there seemed to be nothing keeping
us together, really. No glue.

909
00:47:09,960 --> 00:47:11,960
And finally,

910
00:47:11,960 --> 00:47:14,960
you know,
there was total enmity between them.

911
00:47:14,960 --> 00:47:19,480
But the enmity at the end
between Gerry and Sylvia

912
00:47:19,480 --> 00:47:23,800
was vituperative or intense.

913
00:47:23,800 --> 00:47:25,960
The whole crew knew
that it was going rotten,

914
00:47:25,960 --> 00:47:28,960
and it was an unhappy time
for everybody.

915
00:47:28,960 --> 00:47:32,960
At the end of every feature film
or television series,

916
00:47:32,960 --> 00:47:35,320
there is an end-of-shooting party.

917
00:47:35,320 --> 00:47:38,960
And things were so bad
with Sylvia and myself

918
00:47:38,960 --> 00:47:41,960
that when we got home, I said,

919
00:47:41,960 --> 00:47:43,960
"Look, if you want to go
to the party, that's fine,

920
00:47:43,960 --> 00:47:45,960
"but if you're gonna go, I'm not."

921
00:47:45,960 --> 00:47:48,960
And she said, "No, I'm not going,
I don't want to go.

922
00:47:48,960 --> 00:47:50,800
"I'm not gonna spoil your evening."

923
00:47:50,800 --> 00:47:53,000
And I said, "OK, fine."
And I went to the party.

924
00:47:53,000 --> 00:47:54,960
It was all very nice,
and everyone was jolly,

925
00:47:54,960 --> 00:47:56,960
and we were all drinking and happy,

926
00:47:56,960 --> 00:47:59,960
and then she made her appearance.
She came in.

927
00:47:59,960 --> 00:48:03,960
And I went over and said,
"I thought you weren't coming?"

928
00:48:03,960 --> 00:48:05,960
And she said, "Why, is there a law

929
00:48:05,960 --> 00:48:07,960
"that I can't come
to Pinewood Studios?"

930
00:48:07,960 --> 00:48:12,960
And I got very, very steamed up.
You know, very hurt.

931
00:48:12,960 --> 00:48:14,960
And when the party was over,

932
00:48:14,960 --> 00:48:18,000
there was somebody who I knew very,
very well, David Withers -

933
00:48:18,000 --> 00:48:20,960
he was a fairly important
member of ITC -

934
00:48:20,960 --> 00:48:24,960
and Sylvia said, "We're going home.
Dave, do you wanna come with us?"

935
00:48:24,960 --> 00:48:26,960
I was seething.
Last thing I wanted to do

936
00:48:26,960 --> 00:48:28,960
was have to pretend
in front of people.

937
00:48:28,960 --> 00:48:30,960
Cos I knew as soon as we got home,
there'd be a blazing row.

938
00:48:30,960 --> 00:48:33,960
So he said, "Oh, lovely."
So he came back.

939
00:48:33,960 --> 00:48:36,640
So there's Dave, Sylvia and myself.

940
00:48:36,640 --> 00:48:37,960
And we were bickering.

941
00:48:37,960 --> 00:48:39,960
And the argument
became quite intense.

942
00:48:39,960 --> 00:48:42,960
You know, a really nasty,
nasty scene.

943
00:48:42,960 --> 00:48:45,640
And Dave, who I'd known for years,

944
00:48:45,640 --> 00:48:47,160
and I never knew
that he played the piano.

945
00:48:47,160 --> 00:48:49,960
And he went over
and he lifted the piano,

946
00:48:49,960 --> 00:48:52,960
and he started to play scales.
Wonderful.

947
00:48:52,960 --> 00:48:53,960
OK, Gerry. Keep it going.

948
00:48:53,960 --> 00:48:57,960
PIANO PLAYING, GUNFIRE

949
00:48:57,960 --> 00:49:00,960
And at the end of the argument,
I said,

950
00:49:00,960 --> 00:49:02,960
"That's it, I've had enough,

951
00:49:02,960 --> 00:49:04,960
"I'm not having any more.
I'm leaving."

952
00:49:04,960 --> 00:49:06,960
That's when it was over.

953
00:49:06,960 --> 00:49:09,000
Dad wanted to proceed
with a divorce.

954
00:49:09,000 --> 00:49:13,960
The divorce case, and then
the custody case for Gerry Jr,

955
00:49:13,960 --> 00:49:18,960
went on for, I think,
six or seven years from that point.

956
00:49:18,960 --> 00:49:22,960
The break-up of the marriage
was costing dearly,

957
00:49:22,960 --> 00:49:26,960
and I think the understanding was,
I got from Gerry,

958
00:49:26,960 --> 00:49:28,960
that he virtually
used all of his savings

959
00:49:28,960 --> 00:49:31,640
to try and get access to Gerry Jr.

960
00:49:31,640 --> 00:49:34,960
But when I left Sylvia, I said,

961
00:49:34,960 --> 00:49:38,000
"Look, we divide everything
exactly in half." Which we did.

962
00:49:38,000 --> 00:49:40,960
She did her thing,
and I did my thing.

963
00:49:40,960 --> 00:49:42,960
I bought my flat outright.

964
00:49:42,960 --> 00:49:45,960
I did it up beautifully,
cos I know I'm gonna be a bachelor.

965
00:49:45,960 --> 00:49:48,960
And then the trouble started
with Gerry.

966
00:49:48,960 --> 00:49:50,960
A legal battle
to try and see my son.

967
00:49:50,960 --> 00:49:52,960
From being a very successful person,

968
00:49:52,960 --> 00:49:56,960
his life, I think,
took a very serious downturn,

969
00:49:56,960 --> 00:50:00,960
and he really financially struggled,

970
00:50:00,960 --> 00:50:03,960
and lost a lot of the wealth
that he had gained.

971
00:50:03,960 --> 00:50:07,960
What happened was,
for however many years,

972
00:50:07,960 --> 00:50:09,960
I was in and out of court,

973
00:50:09,960 --> 00:50:12,960
barristers, affidavits,
God knows what,

974
00:50:12,960 --> 00:50:16,960
and she used every trick in
the trade to prevent me seeing him.

975
00:50:16,960 --> 00:50:18,960
Cos I remember him once saying,

976
00:50:18,960 --> 00:50:22,960
"David, if she came into this room,
I'd hit her."

977
00:50:22,960 --> 00:50:25,160
He was distraught,

978
00:50:25,160 --> 00:50:27,320
because he'd sort of lost touch

979
00:50:27,320 --> 00:50:30,960
with his two daughters
from his first marriage,

980
00:50:30,960 --> 00:50:32,960
and he couldn't bear the thought
of losing a third child,

981
00:50:32,960 --> 00:50:34,960
especially a son,

982
00:50:34,960 --> 00:50:39,960
but Gerry was the apple of his eye,
so...

983
00:50:39,960 --> 00:50:43,960
He told me that
they were going to court

984
00:50:43,960 --> 00:50:45,960
in the discussion
of the divorce proceedings,

985
00:50:45,960 --> 00:50:48,960
and Gerry had turned up there
with his lawyer,

986
00:50:48,960 --> 00:50:51,960
and he obviously had money still
to be able to afford his lawyer,

987
00:50:51,960 --> 00:50:54,960
and was there in a suit,
and very presentable.

988
00:50:54,960 --> 00:50:57,960
And Sylvia turned up in rags.

989
00:50:57,960 --> 00:51:00,960
I don't ever remember seeing Sylvia
in old clothes.

990
00:51:00,960 --> 00:51:02,960
She was always immaculate.

991
00:51:02,960 --> 00:51:04,960
She was, erm,

992
00:51:04,960 --> 00:51:07,960
dishevelled, I think
is the word that Gerry used.

993
00:51:07,960 --> 00:51:09,960
Appealing on the court

994
00:51:09,960 --> 00:51:15,480
so that they would award her
whatever the final award was.

995
00:51:15,480 --> 00:51:20,960
He was outwitted by a smarter brain
when it came to that sort of thing.

996
00:51:20,960 --> 00:51:26,320
I think the one thing that
I wasn't able to forgive her for

997
00:51:26,320 --> 00:51:31,960
was that she made sure that he
didn't see his other son again.

998
00:51:31,960 --> 00:51:35,960
This has been a long and tiring case
for all concerned.

999
00:51:35,960 --> 00:51:40,320
Finally, I got a letter from
the court, I had won the case.

1000
00:51:40,320 --> 00:51:43,960
Lay it out,
I would see him every other weekend,

1001
00:51:43,960 --> 00:51:45,960
two weeks' holiday a year.

1002
00:51:45,960 --> 00:51:47,960
So I then phoned Sylvia and said,

1003
00:51:47,960 --> 00:51:50,960
"I would like to see Gerry
this weekend."

1004
00:51:50,960 --> 00:51:51,960
"Of course."

1005
00:51:51,960 --> 00:51:53,960
I said, "Oh, good,
I'll come and pick him up."

1006
00:51:53,960 --> 00:51:56,000
"No, no, no,
I'll deliver him to you."

1007
00:51:56,000 --> 00:51:57,160
"Thank you."

1008
00:51:57,160 --> 00:52:00,960
I woke up Saturday morning, because
there was a noise on the letterbox,

1009
00:52:00,960 --> 00:52:02,000
and I thought it was the postman.

1010
00:52:02,000 --> 00:52:05,960
When I went to the front door,
there was a letter.

1011
00:52:05,960 --> 00:52:08,640
Let's hope it's good news.

1012
00:52:08,640 --> 00:52:10,960
And it was from Gerry,
basically saying,

1013
00:52:10,960 --> 00:52:15,960
"Dear Dad, I don't want to see you.
I don't ever want to see you again."

1014
00:52:15,960 --> 00:52:19,960
When I met him for the first time,
after all these years,

1015
00:52:19,960 --> 00:52:22,480
he phoned me out of the blue,
and we met in a hotel,

1016
00:52:22,480 --> 00:52:23,960
like on neutral ground,

1017
00:52:23,960 --> 00:52:27,960
and he came in and said,
"Oh, hello", and he sat down,

1018
00:52:27,960 --> 00:52:30,160
and almost the first thing he said
was,

1019
00:52:30,160 --> 00:52:32,640
"You realise
I didn't write that letter?

1020
00:52:32,640 --> 00:52:33,960
"I was made to write it."

1021
00:52:33,960 --> 00:52:35,960
It was almost the first thing
he said.

1022
00:52:35,960 --> 00:52:37,960
Sadly,
after their brief reconciliation,

1023
00:52:37,960 --> 00:52:39,960
the relationship broke down,

1024
00:52:39,960 --> 00:52:42,960
and Dad didn't see Gerry Jr again.

1025
00:52:42,960 --> 00:52:46,640
People go out of their way to say,
"Of course I'm not bitter.

1026
00:52:46,640 --> 00:52:49,960
"This man came in and blew my
mother's head off with a shotgun,

1027
00:52:49,960 --> 00:52:51,640
"but I'm not bitter." You know?

1028
00:52:51,640 --> 00:52:52,960
I'm bloody bitter!

1029
00:52:52,960 --> 00:52:54,960
Yes, I am bitter.

1030
00:52:54,960 --> 00:52:57,960
And I don't try to cover it.
You know, I think it was terrible.

1031
00:52:57,960 --> 00:53:01,640
And I think the truth is, I hate her
more every day that goes by.

1032
00:53:01,640 --> 00:53:03,960
Nothing gets better.
Nothing heals.

1033
00:53:06,000 --> 00:53:09,960
He was very vulnerable.
Very gullible.

1034
00:53:09,960 --> 00:53:12,640
And totally lost.

1035
00:53:12,640 --> 00:53:16,960
Yeah, he was pretty well drained
of money.

1036
00:53:16,960 --> 00:53:19,960
From the point when Lew
had agreed to fund Supercar,

1037
00:53:19,960 --> 00:53:23,960
Lew had always backed Dad,
for every project.

1038
00:53:23,960 --> 00:53:27,000
In fact, he famously got cross
with Dad

1039
00:53:27,000 --> 00:53:29,960
when Dad wasn't certain that
Lew would like an upcoming idea.

1040
00:53:29,960 --> 00:53:32,960
Which turned out to be,
I think, Thunderbirds.

1041
00:53:32,960 --> 00:53:33,960
And Lew said to Dad...

1042
00:53:33,960 --> 00:53:36,000
"Gerry, if you want to make a series
about that light bulb,

1043
00:53:36,000 --> 00:53:37,320
"I'll back it."

1044
00:53:37,320 --> 00:53:39,960
By the mid-late 1970s,

1045
00:53:39,960 --> 00:53:43,960
ATV, which had then become ITC,

1046
00:53:43,960 --> 00:53:47,960
was a lot more corporate.
It had got bigger,

1047
00:53:47,960 --> 00:53:49,960
America was involved,

1048
00:53:49,960 --> 00:53:54,960
and Lew was beginning
to lose his grip of ATV.

1049
00:53:54,960 --> 00:53:57,960
He was no longer the man
who could just say,

1050
00:53:57,960 --> 00:53:59,960
"Yeah, let's make it,
I'll find the money."

1051
00:53:59,960 --> 00:54:03,320
Suddenly, he was under scrutiny
from other people within ATV.

1052
00:54:03,320 --> 00:54:06,960
Well, the president of Lew's
company in New York phoned and said,

1053
00:54:06,960 --> 00:54:08,960
"Lew, cancel the renewal."

1054
00:54:08,960 --> 00:54:11,960
And I think that meant that Lew

1055
00:54:11,960 --> 00:54:15,960
could no longer be the yes-man
that he always had been.

1056
00:54:15,960 --> 00:54:19,800
I think he could see disaster
coming down the tracks.

1057
00:54:19,800 --> 00:54:23,960
And then that left Dad
without a solid backer.

1058
00:54:23,960 --> 00:54:25,800
Looks like I'm on my own.

1059
00:54:25,800 --> 00:54:29,960
Once Space: 1999 finished,
there was no work.

1060
00:54:29,960 --> 00:54:35,800
If this is the end of one life,
we have to start to build a new one.

1061
00:54:36,960 --> 00:54:39,960
In my biography,
the dedication reads,

1062
00:54:39,960 --> 00:54:42,160
"To Mary, who saved my life."

1063
00:54:42,160 --> 00:54:44,320
And that's absolutely true.

1064
00:54:44,320 --> 00:54:46,960
She was a gentle soul.

1065
00:54:46,960 --> 00:54:48,800
She was nice.

1066
00:54:48,800 --> 00:54:51,960
She wasn't assertive, or aggressive,

1067
00:54:51,960 --> 00:54:54,960
or someone who's always got to win.

1068
00:54:54,960 --> 00:54:57,480
She didn't get caught up
in his drama.

1069
00:54:57,480 --> 00:54:59,960
It's not uncommon for people
to refer to their wives

1070
00:54:59,960 --> 00:55:01,960
as their better halves,
and Gerry, I think,

1071
00:55:01,960 --> 00:55:03,480
lucked out with Mary.

1072
00:55:03,480 --> 00:55:04,960
She was his better half,
in many respects.

1073
00:55:04,960 --> 00:55:07,960
We used to go to a pub in Cookham.

1074
00:55:07,960 --> 00:55:10,960
It was a pub where Arthur,
the waiter,

1075
00:55:10,960 --> 00:55:13,960
contributed his voice to Parker.

1076
00:55:13,960 --> 00:55:16,960
And there was a very sophisticated
girl standing there,

1077
00:55:16,960 --> 00:55:20,960
and I suppose, if the truth
were to be known,

1078
00:55:20,960 --> 00:55:22,960
I used to look at her

1079
00:55:22,960 --> 00:55:25,480
and have thoughts
that I can't repeat on camera.

1080
00:55:25,480 --> 00:55:27,640
But some years later,
I was sitting there,

1081
00:55:27,640 --> 00:55:29,960
I'd left Sylvia now,

1082
00:55:29,960 --> 00:55:31,960
and I was very lonely,

1083
00:55:31,960 --> 00:55:34,960
and a very attractive girl
came around

1084
00:55:34,960 --> 00:55:37,960
with a big silver tray of drinks.

1085
00:55:37,960 --> 00:55:40,960
And then I said to somebody,
"Who is the girl?"

1086
00:55:40,960 --> 00:55:42,960
And they said, "Don't be daft,

1087
00:55:42,960 --> 00:55:45,960
"she's the girl who used to work
at The King's Arms."

1088
00:55:45,960 --> 00:55:50,480
I think he was just finishing
the first series of Space: 1999,

1089
00:55:50,480 --> 00:55:53,800
And I was working at Bray
for Brian Johnson

1090
00:55:53,800 --> 00:55:55,960
on the special effects unit.

1091
00:55:55,960 --> 00:55:57,640
I've never been very good
with women,

1092
00:55:57,640 --> 00:56:01,960
so I kind of went home and rehearsed
how I was going to ring her,

1093
00:56:01,960 --> 00:56:05,160
and I made up some cock and bull
story and invited her over,

1094
00:56:05,160 --> 00:56:06,960
and that's how it all began.

1095
00:56:06,960 --> 00:56:10,640
He had got into a position, I think,
where he thought, after Sylvia,

1096
00:56:10,640 --> 00:56:11,960
he would never get married again.

1097
00:56:11,960 --> 00:56:14,000
You don't marry the person
you want to live with.

1098
00:56:14,000 --> 00:56:16,640
You marry the person
you can't live without.

1099
00:56:16,640 --> 00:56:20,960
But Mum appears to have been
the right person to change his mind.

1100
00:56:20,960 --> 00:56:24,960
When he learned that
I was expecting, he was surprised.

1101
00:56:24,960 --> 00:56:28,960
A baby! Ooh!

1102
00:56:28,960 --> 00:56:29,960
I was horrified.

1103
00:56:29,960 --> 00:56:34,960
I mean, you know, "I'll be dead
before the child's grown up."

1104
00:56:34,960 --> 00:56:37,960
And she was very philosophical
about it, and she talked me into it.

1105
00:56:37,960 --> 00:56:39,960
And suddenly I had a family again.

1106
00:56:39,960 --> 00:56:44,800
And everything returned to normal,
everything was repaired,

1107
00:56:44,800 --> 00:56:46,960
and life is great once more.

1108
00:56:46,960 --> 00:56:50,960
That was when Gerry
was really happy, I think.

1109
00:56:53,960 --> 00:56:56,960
'Turn around.'

1110
00:56:56,960 --> 00:56:58,960
'Don't come any closer.'

1111
00:57:05,960 --> 00:57:07,960
I think Mary grounded him.

1112
00:57:07,960 --> 00:57:09,960
And one thing for sure I can say

1113
00:57:09,960 --> 00:57:12,960
is that Mary didn't marry me
for my money.

1114
00:57:12,960 --> 00:57:16,960
As a matter of fact, she used to
go out to work and earn money

1115
00:57:16,960 --> 00:57:19,800
while I was at home
wearing an overcoat

1116
00:57:19,800 --> 00:57:20,960
because the flat was so cold

1117
00:57:20,960 --> 00:57:23,480
and we couldn't afford to put
the heating on, writing a script,

1118
00:57:23,480 --> 00:57:24,960
and then she would spend
the whole evening

1119
00:57:24,960 --> 00:57:27,000
typing it out and putting it
into good English.

1120
00:57:27,000 --> 00:57:30,960
And I think that was around the time
the bailiffs had been in

1121
00:57:30,960 --> 00:57:32,960
and confiscated some paintings.

1122
00:57:32,960 --> 00:57:35,960
It really shows
you've hit rock bottom

1123
00:57:35,960 --> 00:57:37,960
when the bailiffs come in.

1124
00:57:37,960 --> 00:57:40,960
And it wasn't until, I think,
we met Christopher Burr

1125
00:57:40,960 --> 00:57:43,960
that life started to look
a little bit better.

1126
00:57:43,960 --> 00:57:46,960
Christopher Burr was a very,
very complex character.

1127
00:57:46,960 --> 00:57:47,960
Very, very complicated.

1128
00:57:47,960 --> 00:57:50,960
An utterly brilliant businessman.

1129
00:57:50,960 --> 00:57:52,960
He, after several trips to Japan,

1130
00:57:52,960 --> 00:57:54,960
got the money together
for Terrahawks.

1131
00:57:54,960 --> 00:57:57,960
He's a miracle man.
An absolute miracle man.

1132
00:57:57,960 --> 00:58:01,960
So he raised the money for the show.
But it wasn't nearly enough.

1133
00:58:01,960 --> 00:58:03,960
And I was desperate to make it.

1134
00:58:03,960 --> 00:58:06,960
And it was the first stepping stone
to my recovery.

1135
00:58:06,960 --> 00:58:09,960
They weren't besties,

1136
00:58:09,960 --> 00:58:12,480
but they worked well together.

1137
00:58:12,480 --> 00:58:14,160
And then, as people do,

1138
00:58:14,160 --> 00:58:15,960
Christopher suddenly, I think,

1139
00:58:15,960 --> 00:58:19,960
got a bit bored
with the film business.

1140
00:58:19,960 --> 00:58:20,960
I think what brought it to an end

1141
00:58:20,960 --> 00:58:23,960
was that Christopher bought himself
a lovely house in Portugal,

1142
00:58:23,960 --> 00:58:25,960
and he fell in love with Portugal.

1143
00:58:25,960 --> 00:58:27,960
And he started to play golf.

1144
00:58:27,960 --> 00:58:31,640
And finally, I said to him,
"I don't think we can go on."

1145
00:58:31,640 --> 00:58:33,960
And we decided to part company
amicably.

1146
00:58:33,960 --> 00:58:37,320
They didn't really talk again,
because Gerry had this thing

1147
00:58:37,320 --> 00:58:40,960
of once people were out of his life,
they were out.

1148
00:58:40,960 --> 00:58:45,160
Relationships
don't come about easily.

1149
00:58:45,160 --> 00:58:47,960
Gerry wasn't above demonising people
in his shows.

1150
00:58:47,960 --> 00:58:50,960
I was aware of Roger Lefkon,

1151
00:58:50,960 --> 00:58:56,960
who was part of the funding package
for Space Precinct.

1152
00:58:56,960 --> 00:59:00,960
I heard that there were funding
problems on Space Precinct.

1153
00:59:00,960 --> 00:59:04,960
I heard Roger's name was associated
with those funding problems.

1154
00:59:04,960 --> 00:59:05,960
And so Dad was adamant

1155
00:59:05,960 --> 00:59:09,960
that when they made
new Captain Scarlet in 2005,

1156
00:59:09,960 --> 00:59:14,800
that the baddie, Captain Black,
be given the surname Lefkon.

1157
00:59:14,800 --> 00:59:18,960
The only thing we're both certain
of is Conrad Lefkon died on Mars.

1158
00:59:18,960 --> 00:59:20,000
The Mysterons killed him.

1159
00:59:20,000 --> 00:59:22,960
And then, of course,
there is Zelda in Terrahawks.

1160
00:59:22,960 --> 00:59:25,960
Be quiet, you snivelling wretch!

1161
00:59:25,960 --> 00:59:31,160
Richard Gregory had told me that
he was given loose instruction

1162
00:59:31,160 --> 00:59:33,960
to push the character
in a particular direction,

1163
00:59:33,960 --> 00:59:36,960
which made it look
not unlike Sylvia.

1164
00:59:36,960 --> 00:59:40,960
And being the evil character,
evil demon in the show,

1165
00:59:40,960 --> 00:59:43,960
it was obviously a loaded sculpt.

1166
00:59:43,960 --> 00:59:46,000
I can leave it up to
viewers of Terrahawks

1167
00:59:46,000 --> 00:59:48,960
to decide whether they think
that's true or not.

1168
00:59:50,960 --> 00:59:54,800
I think that had Gerry

1169
00:59:54,800 --> 00:59:57,960
kept all his contacts and friends

1170
00:59:57,960 --> 01:00:03,000
as he moved up through
his various series,

1171
01:00:03,000 --> 01:00:08,160
he would have probably done
a lot better in later years.

1172
01:00:08,160 --> 01:00:11,960
To me, a relationship
is the only thing that counts.

1173
01:00:11,960 --> 01:00:13,480
And I remember he said to me,

1174
01:00:13,480 --> 01:00:18,960
"Oh, John,
I wish I'd seen more of you.

1175
01:00:18,960 --> 01:00:23,960
"When I was busy,
I was asked to lunch and everything.

1176
01:00:23,960 --> 01:00:27,960
"Soon as I haven't any work,
nobody wants to know."

1177
01:00:30,480 --> 01:00:34,000
Everybody who had a friendship
with Gerry formerly

1178
01:00:34,000 --> 01:00:36,640
was somebody who was useful to him,
I think.

1179
01:00:36,640 --> 01:00:39,960
He found it very hard
to make friends,

1180
01:00:39,960 --> 01:00:44,960
and I think he just,
maybe in the earlier days,

1181
01:00:44,960 --> 01:00:49,960
didn't see the value of maintaining
good relationships with people.

1182
01:00:49,960 --> 01:00:51,960
If you look at Gerry's history
with producers,

1183
01:00:51,960 --> 01:00:53,960
there's a long list of producers
who worked with him.

1184
01:00:53,960 --> 01:00:56,640
You have failed,
and must pay the price.

1185
01:00:56,640 --> 01:00:59,160
He had a thin skin, I think, Gerry.

1186
01:00:59,160 --> 01:01:01,960
As with Oscar Wilde,

1187
01:01:01,960 --> 01:01:04,960
there was a thing called
The Gentle Art Of Making Enemies.

1188
01:01:04,960 --> 01:01:07,960
My temperament is like
riding a roller-coaster.

1189
01:01:07,960 --> 01:01:10,960
I don't think I'm the only one
who'll say

1190
01:01:10,960 --> 01:01:12,960
that if he took against somebody,

1191
01:01:12,960 --> 01:01:15,960
then there'd be fireworks.
He wouldn't work with them again.

1192
01:01:15,960 --> 01:01:19,960
I remember when we were making
a commercial for Toilet Duck.

1193
01:01:19,960 --> 01:01:23,960
It was always difficult
working with clients from abroad,

1194
01:01:23,960 --> 01:01:25,960
and certainly, our clients
didn't have very good English.

1195
01:01:25,960 --> 01:01:29,960
And Gerry would always
check with them and say,

1196
01:01:29,960 --> 01:01:33,640
"This is the set up, have a look
through the camera, are you happy?"

1197
01:01:33,640 --> 01:01:34,960
"Yeah, yeah, everybody's happy."

1198
01:01:34,960 --> 01:01:38,960
And so we probably spent
two or three hours doing the setup.

1199
01:01:38,960 --> 01:01:42,640
We were running behind because it
was such a complicated shot to get.

1200
01:01:42,640 --> 01:01:46,480
And eventually, we did get the shot,
and Gerry was happy,

1201
01:01:46,480 --> 01:01:49,960
and he turned around to the
advertising agency representatives

1202
01:01:49,960 --> 01:01:51,320
and said, "Are you happy?"

1203
01:01:51,320 --> 01:01:52,960
And they went,
"Yeah, yeah, we're happy."

1204
01:01:52,960 --> 01:01:54,960
"Are you sure?"
"Yeah, yeah."

1205
01:01:54,960 --> 01:01:56,960
And so we started to strike the set,

1206
01:01:56,960 --> 01:01:59,960
and then one of them turned around
and said, "Oh, could we just...?"

1207
01:01:59,960 --> 01:02:02,960
And Gerry just went
absolutely ballistic,

1208
01:02:02,960 --> 01:02:05,960
and screamed and shouted
and whatever.

1209
01:02:05,960 --> 01:02:07,960
No bad language, but...

1210
01:02:07,960 --> 01:02:09,960
I'm not afraid to say what I think.

1211
01:02:09,960 --> 01:02:11,960
I'm not afraid of
going into a blazing row.

1212
01:02:11,960 --> 01:02:14,000
If that's what it takes
to get the bitter out, I'll do it.

1213
01:02:14,000 --> 01:02:18,960
I think if Gerry thought he was
being creatively trodden upon,

1214
01:02:18,960 --> 01:02:20,960
then that would be enough,
on occasion, to,

1215
01:02:20,960 --> 01:02:23,960
if he didn't like you,
to put you on the back burner.

1216
01:02:23,960 --> 01:02:25,960
I think we all know

1217
01:02:25,960 --> 01:02:27,960
when a relationship
starts to come to an end.

1218
01:02:27,960 --> 01:02:30,960
As Captain Scarlet finished,
Gerry and I's working relationship

1219
01:02:30,960 --> 01:02:32,480
wasn't as good as it had been.

1220
01:02:32,480 --> 01:02:35,960
I actually called Gerry
and said to him,

1221
01:02:35,960 --> 01:02:39,480
"Listen, Gerry, I think this is
a really disappointing situation.

1222
01:02:39,480 --> 01:02:41,640
"I don't want it to end like this,

1223
01:02:41,640 --> 01:02:44,960
"and I'd just like
if we could maintain a friendship."

1224
01:02:44,960 --> 01:02:47,960
And Gerry very kindly said,
"Come up for lunch."

1225
01:02:47,960 --> 01:02:50,960
But he was a different Gerry.

1226
01:02:50,960 --> 01:02:51,960
He'd made his decision,

1227
01:02:51,960 --> 01:02:55,000
and I wasn't gonna be a part
of any future productions.

1228
01:02:55,000 --> 01:02:58,960
It didn't matter to him
that I wasn't a friend any more.

1229
01:02:58,960 --> 01:03:01,000
Towards the end of his life,
I think that was more likely

1230
01:03:01,000 --> 01:03:02,960
because of his dementia kicking in.

1231
01:03:02,960 --> 01:03:05,960
It's beyond my comprehension,
the thought of retiring,

1232
01:03:05,960 --> 01:03:09,480
not unless some ill health
forces it.

1233
01:03:09,480 --> 01:03:11,960
Hindsight is a wonderful thing.

1234
01:03:11,960 --> 01:03:14,960
None of us on the production
knew that he wasn't very well.

1235
01:03:14,960 --> 01:03:18,960
Looking back on it,
there were clear and obvious signs.

1236
01:03:18,960 --> 01:03:21,960
I recall around 2003,

1237
01:03:21,960 --> 01:03:23,960
so long before
there was any diagnosis,

1238
01:03:23,960 --> 01:03:26,960
or any real sign
that there was something wrong.

1239
01:03:26,960 --> 01:03:30,960
He would forget appointments,

1240
01:03:30,960 --> 01:03:34,960
or get them muddled,
he'd get them on the wrong day.

1241
01:03:34,960 --> 01:03:38,960
His driving became erratic.

1242
01:03:38,960 --> 01:03:42,960
Dad had come into London to
pick me and a friend up from Fulham

1243
01:03:42,960 --> 01:03:44,960
and drive us back home.

1244
01:03:44,960 --> 01:03:46,960
And we were driving out on the M4,

1245
01:03:46,960 --> 01:03:51,960
and my friend Jack
nudged me in the ribs

1246
01:03:51,960 --> 01:03:53,960
and looked down
at the side of the car,

1247
01:03:53,960 --> 01:03:55,960
and I looked down,

1248
01:03:55,960 --> 01:03:58,960
and his lane placement
was really weird,

1249
01:03:58,960 --> 01:03:59,960
he was sort of...

1250
01:03:59,960 --> 01:04:01,960
Not even drifting, but just the car

1251
01:04:01,960 --> 01:04:05,320
was placed slightly over
the white lines, out of the lane.

1252
01:04:05,320 --> 01:04:06,960
He was a really good driver.

1253
01:04:06,960 --> 01:04:09,960
He was a fast driver,
but he had really good reflexes.

1254
01:04:09,960 --> 01:04:12,800
I mean,
I think he really enjoyed driving.

1255
01:04:12,800 --> 01:04:15,960
And at the time, I just thought,
"Oh, he's distracted", or whatever.

1256
01:04:15,960 --> 01:04:19,960
Looking at his GPS monitor, or
thinking about something else, or...

1257
01:04:19,960 --> 01:04:26,960
But that was the start of us seeing
changes in his driving ability,

1258
01:04:26,960 --> 01:04:28,960
changes in his spatial awareness.

1259
01:04:28,960 --> 01:04:32,480
By early 2004,

1260
01:04:32,480 --> 01:04:36,480
I was seeing more strange moments
in his driving.

1261
01:04:36,480 --> 01:04:38,960
Entering roundabouts
in the wrong lane,

1262
01:04:38,960 --> 01:04:42,800
having little, tiny accidents,
moments,

1263
01:04:42,800 --> 01:04:44,960
just where he would
sort of scrape his car,

1264
01:04:44,960 --> 01:04:47,960
little things that, at the time,
you think, "Oh, he's being clumsy",

1265
01:04:47,960 --> 01:04:51,960
but it all added up to
starting to look a bit strange.

1266
01:04:51,960 --> 01:04:52,960
And within a year of that,

1267
01:04:52,960 --> 01:04:54,960
he was starting to have
real problems driving.

1268
01:04:54,960 --> 01:04:56,320
Again, which, at the time...

1269
01:04:56,320 --> 01:04:58,960
It seems ridiculous now,
but you brush them off,

1270
01:04:58,960 --> 01:05:01,960
and you say, "Oh, he's stressed",
or, "He's tired."

1271
01:05:01,960 --> 01:05:07,960
He would get lost on a simple
journey between home and Pinewood.

1272
01:05:07,960 --> 01:05:10,960
Which, you know,
was his second home.

1273
01:05:10,960 --> 01:05:15,960
He'd been coming to Pinewood
for probably 50 years by that point.

1274
01:05:15,960 --> 01:05:17,960
So, one time he came to Pinewood
to have lunch with me,

1275
01:05:17,960 --> 01:05:21,960
and he'd got back into his car
and taken four hours to get home.

1276
01:05:21,960 --> 01:05:24,960
I was about to call the police
to report him missing.

1277
01:05:24,960 --> 01:05:28,800
And you would think, at that point,
that your natural response would be,

1278
01:05:28,800 --> 01:05:32,960
"OK, we've got to get this
checked out", but even then...

1279
01:05:32,960 --> 01:05:35,960
Because he was so insistent
that he was absolutely fine,

1280
01:05:35,960 --> 01:05:37,960
and there was no problem,

1281
01:05:37,960 --> 01:05:43,480
you would just sort of go, "Oh, OK,
we'll agree with you, in that case."

1282
01:05:43,480 --> 01:05:48,960
I can't remember the exact incident
that catalysed me into action.

1283
01:05:50,800 --> 01:05:56,000
But I think I remember watching
a documentary about Terry Pratchett,

1284
01:05:56,000 --> 01:05:58,960
who had recently been diagnosed

1285
01:05:58,960 --> 01:06:01,960
with a very specific
form of dementia called PCA.

1286
01:06:01,960 --> 01:06:04,320
And in that documentary,

1287
01:06:04,320 --> 01:06:09,960
I think Terry talked about confusing
the phone for the TV remote.

1288
01:06:11,160 --> 01:06:14,960
And I thought,
"I've seen Dad do that."

1289
01:06:14,960 --> 01:06:16,960
I rung him,
and every time I rung him,

1290
01:06:16,960 --> 01:06:19,960
he picked up the phone
and he said, "Hello,"

1291
01:06:19,960 --> 01:06:21,960
and I said,
"Hello, Daddy, it's Joy."

1292
01:06:21,960 --> 01:06:23,960
And he put the phone down.

1293
01:06:23,960 --> 01:06:25,960
And I thought,
"That's really strange,

1294
01:06:25,960 --> 01:06:27,960
"I don't think we've had
an argument or anything."

1295
01:06:27,960 --> 01:06:30,960
So I tried again and again,
and every time, it was the same.

1296
01:06:30,960 --> 01:06:33,800
So I just stopped ringing.

1297
01:06:33,800 --> 01:06:36,160
I just thought, "I think we've
got to do something about this."

1298
01:06:36,160 --> 01:06:41,960
And so I suggested
that I go and speak to Dad's GP,

1299
01:06:41,960 --> 01:06:45,960
and I would explain to her that
I was worried about his behaviour

1300
01:06:45,960 --> 01:06:49,160
and I thought there was something
going on, maybe dementia-related,

1301
01:06:49,160 --> 01:06:51,960
and that could she approach this
very delicately?

1302
01:06:51,960 --> 01:06:54,960
She couldn't possibly tell him
that I'd been in to see her,

1303
01:06:54,960 --> 01:06:57,960
because he'd be really upset
by that, and she assured me

1304
01:06:57,960 --> 01:07:00,960
she would handle it
professionally and carefully.

1305
01:07:00,960 --> 01:07:02,960
I explained this all
very, very carefully,

1306
01:07:02,960 --> 01:07:04,960
and she agreed a course of action.

1307
01:07:04,960 --> 01:07:07,960
Dad was due in
for a diabetes screening,

1308
01:07:07,960 --> 01:07:11,960
because he lived with diabetes
for a long time,

1309
01:07:11,960 --> 01:07:15,960
and he went in to see her
for his appointment, sat down,

1310
01:07:15,960 --> 01:07:17,960
and the first thing she said was,

1311
01:07:17,960 --> 01:07:19,960
"Mr Anderson,
your son's been to see me,

1312
01:07:19,960 --> 01:07:22,160
"and he thinks there's
something wrong with your brain."

1313
01:07:22,160 --> 01:07:24,960
He just hit the roof.

1314
01:07:24,960 --> 01:07:27,960
I mean, to him,

1315
01:07:27,960 --> 01:07:33,960
this was the ultimate act
of disloyalty against him.

1316
01:07:33,960 --> 01:07:37,960
He said, in a moment, "I understand
why you did what you did,

1317
01:07:37,960 --> 01:07:41,960
"but what you've done is
the kiss of death for my career."

1318
01:07:41,960 --> 01:07:44,960
I don't think he would speak to me
for about two weeks.

1319
01:07:44,960 --> 01:07:47,960
Anyway, he eventually agreed
to having a few more tests,

1320
01:07:47,960 --> 01:07:51,960
and a dementia diagnosis
was confirmed.

1321
01:07:51,960 --> 01:07:54,480
There is a particular drawing
that one does

1322
01:07:54,480 --> 01:07:57,640
as part of a neuropsychological
battery of testing,

1323
01:07:57,640 --> 01:07:59,480
which is to draw a clock face.

1324
01:07:59,480 --> 01:08:01,960
And to draw a particular time on it.

1325
01:08:01,960 --> 01:08:05,960
And I think that was the thing
that made him realise

1326
01:08:05,960 --> 01:08:09,960
that he was actually
living with Alzheimer's disease.

1327
01:08:10,960 --> 01:08:15,800
It's deeply unpleasant for
the person living with dementia,

1328
01:08:15,800 --> 01:08:18,960
but one could argue it's even worse
for those around them.

1329
01:08:18,960 --> 01:08:20,960
Sometimes I had to phone Jamie
and say,

1330
01:08:20,960 --> 01:08:24,960
"If you don't come home
and have your father for half a day,

1331
01:08:24,960 --> 01:08:27,960
"I'm gonna knife him."
I mean, it was that bad.

1332
01:08:27,960 --> 01:08:30,960
And anybody who's lived with
somebody with dementia

1333
01:08:30,960 --> 01:08:32,960
will tell you the same thing.

1334
01:08:32,960 --> 01:08:34,160
It changes the way you think.

1335
01:08:34,160 --> 01:08:37,960
It changes the way you act
towards people you know and love.

1336
01:08:37,960 --> 01:08:39,960
And Dad would often lash out

1337
01:08:39,960 --> 01:08:43,160
and say extremely hurtful
and unpleasant things.

1338
01:08:43,160 --> 01:08:47,960
It was very tough.
I mean, any carer will tell you,

1339
01:08:47,960 --> 01:08:49,960
because you do slip
into the role of carer,

1340
01:08:49,960 --> 01:08:53,960
and you become, at best, grey,
at worst, invisible.

1341
01:08:53,960 --> 01:08:55,960
There's little assistance.

1342
01:08:55,960 --> 01:08:58,960
I tried several times
to get somebody to come in

1343
01:08:58,960 --> 01:09:00,960
to sit with him,
or maybe take him out,

1344
01:09:00,960 --> 01:09:02,960
and he didn't like them,
didn't want them.

1345
01:09:02,960 --> 01:09:04,960
I mean, she did an incredible job.

1346
01:09:04,960 --> 01:09:08,960
She was his 24/7 carer
for over two years.

1347
01:09:08,960 --> 01:09:12,960
There was a point at which
he had accepted the diagnosis,

1348
01:09:12,960 --> 01:09:14,960
and...

1349
01:09:14,960 --> 01:09:19,960
we were sat chatting,
and he said, "Well, I don't know,

1350
01:09:19,960 --> 01:09:21,960
"I don't see what the point
of having a diagnosis is,

1351
01:09:21,960 --> 01:09:23,960
"because what are they gonna do?"

1352
01:09:23,960 --> 01:09:25,960
And I... I just chanced it and said,

1353
01:09:25,960 --> 01:09:28,960
"The other thing you could do
now that you've got a diagnosis

1354
01:09:28,960 --> 01:09:32,800
"is you could try
and maybe raise awareness about it.

1355
01:09:32,800 --> 01:09:36,960
"You could talk publicly about it,
and it might do some good."

1356
01:09:36,960 --> 01:09:38,960
And I thought,
"There's no way he's gonna do this,

1357
01:09:38,960 --> 01:09:41,960
"because he's already complaining
about the fact

1358
01:09:41,960 --> 01:09:42,960
"that it's ended his career",

1359
01:09:42,960 --> 01:09:46,640
and coming out about
having Alzheimer's disease

1360
01:09:46,640 --> 01:09:50,960
was absolutely the last nail
in the coffin for his career.

1361
01:09:50,960 --> 01:09:52,960
But he, remarkably, said,

1362
01:09:52,960 --> 01:09:57,960
"Hmm, I think I'd like to have
a chat with somebody about that."

1363
01:09:57,960 --> 01:10:02,960
One day, I got a call, I think it
was about spring, 2012, from Jamie,

1364
01:10:02,960 --> 01:10:07,960
introducing himself, and saying
who he was, and who his father was.

1365
01:10:07,960 --> 01:10:10,000
Gerry himself was very aware

1366
01:10:10,000 --> 01:10:12,960
that, being a figure
in the public realm,

1367
01:10:12,960 --> 01:10:16,960
that once he'd made a formal
announcement about his dementia,

1368
01:10:16,960 --> 01:10:19,960
that could be
a positive force for good.

1369
01:10:19,960 --> 01:10:21,960
It was fairly unusual
to get a call like that,

1370
01:10:21,960 --> 01:10:24,960
of someone of that calibre,
and that worldwide recognition,

1371
01:10:24,960 --> 01:10:27,960
to want to do something for others.

1372
01:10:27,960 --> 01:10:31,960
And I particularly found it very
heart-warming, and very humbling.

1373
01:10:31,960 --> 01:10:34,960
After having chats with Jamie
and the family,

1374
01:10:34,960 --> 01:10:37,960
we decided that Gerry
could really support us

1375
01:10:37,960 --> 01:10:39,960
in promoting one of our campaigns,

1376
01:10:39,960 --> 01:10:43,160
which is an ongoing campaign
called Memory Walk.

1377
01:10:43,160 --> 01:10:48,960
He agreed to start
the Alzheimer's Society Memory Walk

1378
01:10:48,960 --> 01:10:53,000
at Battersea, in London.
It's their flagship event.

1379
01:10:53,000 --> 01:10:56,960
And he was starting it
alongside Carey Mulligan

1380
01:10:56,960 --> 01:10:58,960
and Mat Whitecross, the director.

1381
01:10:58,960 --> 01:11:02,960
And the morning of,
I was staying at home,

1382
01:11:02,960 --> 01:11:06,960
and it was supposed to be me driving
him up to London for this event,

1383
01:11:06,960 --> 01:11:09,960
and I think it was
the last public event that he did,

1384
01:11:09,960 --> 01:11:11,960
because he was deteriorating
so fast.

1385
01:11:11,960 --> 01:11:14,960
And I went upstairs,
and I opened the door,

1386
01:11:14,960 --> 01:11:18,000
and he was still in bed,
and he stared at me and said,

1387
01:11:18,000 --> 01:11:21,960
"What are you doing in here...
after what you've done?!"

1388
01:11:21,960 --> 01:11:24,960
And I said, "What have I done, Dad?
What's happened?"

1389
01:11:24,960 --> 01:11:27,320
And he said, "You've moved the door.

1390
01:11:27,320 --> 01:11:30,640
"I could have fallen down the stairs
because you've moved the door."

1391
01:11:30,640 --> 01:11:33,960
And then he said,
"And who sent those children up?"

1392
01:11:33,960 --> 01:11:35,960
"What children?"

1393
01:11:35,960 --> 01:11:38,960
"There were children
dancing around my bed, singing."

1394
01:11:38,960 --> 01:11:40,960
And it's only been quite recently,

1395
01:11:40,960 --> 01:11:42,960
when we've been looking back
at his life,

1396
01:11:42,960 --> 01:11:46,960
that it suddenly occurred to me
that that was a relived memory

1397
01:11:46,960 --> 01:11:50,960
of one of the strongest
recollections he had

1398
01:11:50,960 --> 01:11:53,960
of his experience of anti-Semitism.

1399
01:11:53,960 --> 01:11:56,960
Which was a bunch of kids
dancing around him,

1400
01:11:56,960 --> 01:12:00,960
taunting him at school,
calling him "Jew boy."

1401
01:12:00,960 --> 01:12:02,960
And knowing how bad he'd been,
I thought,

1402
01:12:02,960 --> 01:12:07,320
"There's no way he's gonna be
able to do this start."

1403
01:12:07,320 --> 01:12:09,320
Because he's got to make a speech.

1404
01:12:09,320 --> 01:12:13,960
When he arrived,
he was actually on great form.

1405
01:12:13,960 --> 01:12:16,960
He had a lot of... There was
a lot of love in the crowd.

1406
01:12:16,960 --> 01:12:21,800
There was over 1,000 people there.
I think 2,000 people there.

1407
01:12:21,800 --> 01:12:24,960
And loads of them, of course,
were Thunderbirds fans,

1408
01:12:24,960 --> 01:12:28,480
so they were delighted
to see Gerry there.

1409
01:12:28,480 --> 01:12:30,960
And he responded so well to that.

1410
01:12:30,960 --> 01:12:35,960
He kind of shone in the spotlight.

1411
01:12:35,960 --> 01:12:40,960
He gave a five-minute
hilarious speech.

1412
01:12:40,960 --> 01:12:43,960
The public perception of dementia
changed hugely

1413
01:12:43,960 --> 01:12:46,800
thanks to Gerry Anderson's
involvement.

1414
01:12:46,800 --> 01:12:48,960
I think that Memory Walk,
or that year's Memory Walk,

1415
01:12:48,960 --> 01:12:51,960
raised over £1 million
for Alzheimer's Society.

1416
01:12:51,960 --> 01:12:55,800
Which they have directly attributed
to him.

1417
01:12:55,800 --> 01:12:58,960
It made me really proud, actually,

1418
01:12:58,960 --> 01:13:03,320
because he was such a private man,
who got so easily embarrassed,

1419
01:13:03,320 --> 01:13:05,960
I felt very forgiving, actually.

1420
01:13:05,960 --> 01:13:08,640
I just thought,
"Well, good on you, Dad,

1421
01:13:08,640 --> 01:13:10,960
"that you've been prepared
to do this."

1422
01:13:10,960 --> 01:13:13,480
Because, in a sense,
for somebody like him,

1423
01:13:13,480 --> 01:13:16,960
losing control was like
the ultimate humiliation.

1424
01:13:16,960 --> 01:13:20,960
When he was in quite late stages
of Alzheimer's disease,

1425
01:13:20,960 --> 01:13:24,960
I realised
he was forgetting my name.

1426
01:13:24,960 --> 01:13:27,960
And I would say,
"Hello, Dad, it's Jamie."

1427
01:13:27,960 --> 01:13:32,960
And the recognition of that,
and the meaning of that was fading.

1428
01:13:32,960 --> 01:13:34,640
And then, one day, I was...

1429
01:13:34,640 --> 01:13:36,960
I think, actually,
we were doing an interview

1430
01:13:36,960 --> 01:13:41,960
for a morning programme,
about Alzheimer's disease,

1431
01:13:41,960 --> 01:13:43,960
and he said to the crew,

1432
01:13:43,960 --> 01:13:47,960
"Well, if you need anything,
my big brother's over there."

1433
01:13:47,960 --> 01:13:49,960
And he pointed at me.

1434
01:13:51,160 --> 01:13:53,960
And... At the time, I just thought,

1435
01:13:53,960 --> 01:13:58,160
"Oh, this is a moment of confusion,
and he'll get over it."

1436
01:13:58,160 --> 01:14:00,480
But from that moment forward,

1437
01:14:00,480 --> 01:14:03,000
he only referred to me
as his big brother.

1438
01:14:03,000 --> 01:14:04,960
I actually felt quite touched
by that.

1439
01:14:04,960 --> 01:14:09,480
I said to Jamie,
"That's a real compliment,

1440
01:14:09,480 --> 01:14:12,960
"because, you know,
if he's mixing you up with Lionel,

1441
01:14:12,960 --> 01:14:14,960
"Lionel was very, very special,

1442
01:14:14,960 --> 01:14:16,960
"so he knows you're very special,

1443
01:14:16,960 --> 01:14:19,960
"even if he can't
get your name right."

1444
01:14:19,960 --> 01:14:23,800
From the time that Dad
got his diagnosis, he always said,

1445
01:14:23,800 --> 01:14:27,960
"The moment I am not safe at home,
I want to go into care."

1446
01:14:27,960 --> 01:14:31,960
He had more and more hallucinations
about the space he was living in,

1447
01:14:31,960 --> 01:14:34,480
and he got more and more confused
about where he could go.

1448
01:14:34,480 --> 01:14:38,960
And it was getting to the point
when we thought, "He is days away

1449
01:14:38,960 --> 01:14:41,960
"from potentially stepping out
across the top step

1450
01:14:41,960 --> 01:14:43,000
"and falling down the stairs."

1451
01:14:43,000 --> 01:14:47,960
So Mum and I agreed that it was time
that he needed to go into care.

1452
01:14:47,960 --> 01:14:49,960
Because, you know, she and I
were both at home full time,

1453
01:14:49,960 --> 01:14:52,960
and we couldn't cope
and give him everything he needed

1454
01:14:52,960 --> 01:14:53,960
to keep him safe and well.

1455
01:14:53,960 --> 01:14:57,960
It was horrendous, because he didn't
really understand what was going on.

1456
01:14:57,960 --> 01:14:58,960
So we took him up to the room,

1457
01:14:58,960 --> 01:15:00,960
took all of his stuff up there,
got him settled,

1458
01:15:00,960 --> 01:15:04,320
and he just kept saying,
"Well, I'm not staying here, am I?"

1459
01:15:04,320 --> 01:15:06,960
There was a real sense
of separation anxiety.

1460
01:15:06,960 --> 01:15:10,960
And, er...
He came to the door of the room,

1461
01:15:10,960 --> 01:15:12,960
and the nurse was outside,

1462
01:15:12,960 --> 01:15:15,960
and she said, "Hello, Mr Anderson,
how are you settling in?"

1463
01:15:15,960 --> 01:15:17,480
And he sort of looked at her

1464
01:15:17,480 --> 01:15:19,960
and said, "I'm not settling in,
I'm not staying."

1465
01:15:19,960 --> 01:15:23,000
And she said, "Well, would
you like to meet your neighbour?"

1466
01:15:23,000 --> 01:15:25,960
I said, "That'll be nice, Dad,
let's meet your neighbour."

1467
01:15:25,960 --> 01:15:28,960
An elderly lady came to the door,
and the nurse said,

1468
01:15:28,960 --> 01:15:30,960
"Mr Anderson,
this is your neighbour.

1469
01:15:30,960 --> 01:15:33,320
"Her name's Sylvia."

1470
01:15:33,320 --> 01:15:34,960
And even now, saying it,

1471
01:15:34,960 --> 01:15:37,960
I can feel my heart leaping into
my mouth, because I just thought,

1472
01:15:37,960 --> 01:15:41,800
"This is terrible, this could not be
worse. How is he gonna react?"

1473
01:15:41,800 --> 01:15:43,960
And sort of everything
went in slow motion,

1474
01:15:43,960 --> 01:15:47,960
and after a couple of seconds,
he reached out and said,

1475
01:15:47,960 --> 01:15:51,960
"Oh, hello, nice to meet you,"
and shook her hand.

1476
01:15:53,800 --> 01:15:56,480
And it was in that moment
that I knew for sure

1477
01:15:56,480 --> 01:15:59,960
that he was no longer Dad, really.

1478
01:15:59,960 --> 01:16:03,960
And they say to you,
"Don't come and visit for ten days.

1479
01:16:03,960 --> 01:16:06,640
"Let the...
Let the person settle in."

1480
01:16:06,640 --> 01:16:07,960
You go back after ten days,

1481
01:16:07,960 --> 01:16:09,960
and the person
doesn't know you any more.

1482
01:16:13,960 --> 01:16:16,960
It wasn't just Mum
that he'd forgotten by that stage.

1483
01:16:16,960 --> 01:16:20,960
He couldn't remember
any of the shows that he'd made.

1484
01:16:20,960 --> 01:16:21,960
Not one.

1485
01:16:21,960 --> 01:16:24,960
And he'd been given
a Parker puppet by a fan

1486
01:16:24,960 --> 01:16:27,960
that I took to the care home
to try and comfort him, but...

1487
01:16:27,960 --> 01:16:30,960
Even that meant nothing to him.

1488
01:16:30,960 --> 01:16:34,960
We had a, er...
We had Christmas Day at Mum's.

1489
01:16:35,960 --> 01:16:39,960
And he had really declined
very, very quickly

1490
01:16:39,960 --> 01:16:41,960
once he'd gone into the home,
I mean...

1491
01:16:41,960 --> 01:16:44,960
You know, memories of
where was home and who was Mary.

1492
01:16:44,960 --> 01:16:46,960
All these things had gone.

1493
01:16:46,960 --> 01:16:51,960
Erm, they thought that we had
maybe four or five days to go.

1494
01:16:51,960 --> 01:16:54,960
Because I knew
that the end was coming,

1495
01:16:54,960 --> 01:16:57,960
I decided that on Boxing Day morning
that I would drive home,

1496
01:16:57,960 --> 01:16:59,640
get a load of overnight stuff

1497
01:16:59,640 --> 01:17:01,960
and then come back
and live at Mum's, because...

1498
01:17:01,960 --> 01:17:04,000
I wanted to be around.

1499
01:17:04,000 --> 01:17:06,960
So, we were driving...

1500
01:17:06,960 --> 01:17:07,960
Erm...

1501
01:17:07,960 --> 01:17:11,160
And my phone rang.
And I thought, "Oh, no."

1502
01:17:12,960 --> 01:17:14,960
So I pulled over and answered it.

1503
01:17:14,960 --> 01:17:16,960
And that was the home,
to say that he'd passed away.

1504
01:17:16,960 --> 01:17:17,960
Erm...

1505
01:17:24,000 --> 01:17:26,960
It was about two hours
before I would've gone back.

1506
01:17:33,960 --> 01:17:37,960
When we knew what he knew,
that he didn't have that long to go,

1507
01:17:37,960 --> 01:17:40,960
I said, "Now,
we need to talk about funeral."

1508
01:17:40,960 --> 01:17:43,960
"We'll do something nice and small,
and..."

1509
01:17:43,960 --> 01:17:46,960
"I don't want a small funeral!

1510
01:17:46,960 --> 01:17:48,960
"I want a huge funeral!"

1511
01:17:48,960 --> 01:17:51,960
So that's what he had.
SHE CHUCKLES

1512
01:17:51,960 --> 01:17:53,960
Dying on Boxing Day...

1513
01:17:53,960 --> 01:17:56,960
er, was, was great for that.

1514
01:17:56,960 --> 01:17:58,960
So, he got a huge amount
of news coverage,

1515
01:17:58,960 --> 01:18:00,960
and all the way through,
I was just thinking,

1516
01:18:00,960 --> 01:18:01,960
"God, he really timed this well,

1517
01:18:01,960 --> 01:18:04,960
"because this is exactly
what he would've wanted."

1518
01:18:04,960 --> 01:18:07,160
And so much positivity.
You know, people...

1519
01:18:07,160 --> 01:18:10,480
People tweeting me
and tweeting stuff about him,

1520
01:18:10,480 --> 01:18:12,960
and, you know,
I think somebody tweeted

1521
01:18:12,960 --> 01:18:15,160
that a light had gone out
in the universe.

1522
01:18:15,160 --> 01:18:16,960
People saying, erm...

1523
01:18:18,960 --> 01:18:21,960
"You made my childhood
very special."

1524
01:18:21,960 --> 01:18:24,960
Which was very gratifying.

1525
01:18:24,960 --> 01:18:27,960
What else do you do
for Gerry Anderson's funeral,

1526
01:18:27,960 --> 01:18:31,960
other than get
a life-size FAB 1 pink Rolls-Royce

1527
01:18:31,960 --> 01:18:33,960
to pull up at the funeral?

1528
01:18:33,960 --> 01:18:35,960
His funeral was amazing.

1529
01:18:35,960 --> 01:18:38,960
People came from all over the place.
Came from all over the world.

1530
01:18:38,960 --> 01:18:41,960
We managed to get all the kids
together in the same place.

1531
01:18:41,960 --> 01:18:44,960
They all came to the funeral.
It brought us all together.

1532
01:18:44,960 --> 01:18:47,960
And, er, I was really chuffed

1533
01:18:47,960 --> 01:18:50,960
that Gerry Jr
agreed to be a pallbearer.

1534
01:18:50,960 --> 01:18:52,960
And then we had
a sort of get-together,

1535
01:18:52,960 --> 01:18:55,960
and actually, it was quite strange,
especially reflecting on it now,

1536
01:18:55,960 --> 01:18:57,960
just how many people there were.

1537
01:18:57,960 --> 01:19:01,960
As we've discovered,
he did not necessarily maintain

1538
01:19:01,960 --> 01:19:04,960
personal professional relationships
that well,

1539
01:19:04,960 --> 01:19:07,960
and yet, hundreds and hundreds
of people turned up.

1540
01:19:09,160 --> 01:19:14,000
As part of his ongoing relationship
with Alzheimer's Society

1541
01:19:14,000 --> 01:19:18,960
and Alzheimer's Research,
he had pre-donated his brain.

1542
01:19:18,960 --> 01:19:23,480
We were ardently campaigning
to a particular project

1543
01:19:23,480 --> 01:19:26,480
to forward research into dementia,
and it was called,

1544
01:19:26,480 --> 01:19:28,960
and it is called
Brains for Dementia Research.

1545
01:19:28,960 --> 01:19:30,960
I got a call from the family, erm,

1546
01:19:30,960 --> 01:19:34,960
and I was told
that he would be very happy

1547
01:19:34,960 --> 01:19:37,800
to have his brain
left in a bucket for research.

1548
01:19:37,800 --> 01:19:38,960
It shows the man's humour.

1549
01:19:38,960 --> 01:19:41,320
I think Mum and I held onto
his ashes for nearly a year

1550
01:19:41,320 --> 01:19:43,960
before really deciding what to do.

1551
01:19:43,960 --> 01:19:46,960
And then, one day,
we just chatted and said...

1552
01:19:46,960 --> 01:19:48,960
"Do you know,
these should really go to Pinewood.

1553
01:19:48,960 --> 01:19:50,960
"That's where he belongs."

1554
01:19:50,960 --> 01:19:54,960
So, Mum and I
and Joy and Linda came down.

1555
01:19:54,960 --> 01:20:00,800
I think, er, Gerry Jr had gone back
to his home by then in Tasmania,

1556
01:20:00,800 --> 01:20:04,320
and we just had
a nice, private 15 minutes.

1557
01:20:04,320 --> 01:20:08,960
We were gonna pour the ashes
into the lake from the bridge,

1558
01:20:08,960 --> 01:20:10,960
but it was a bit windy
and that wasn't going to work,

1559
01:20:10,960 --> 01:20:12,960
so I just went down by the lakeside

1560
01:20:12,960 --> 01:20:15,960
while Mum and my two sisters
stood on the bridge, while I...

1561
01:20:16,960 --> 01:20:19,320
..poured his ashes into the lake.

1562
01:20:19,320 --> 01:20:22,960
It's a beautiful place, and it's
nice to have somewhere that is...

1563
01:20:22,960 --> 01:20:26,960
despite its surroundings,
it's sort of unique to him.

1564
01:20:26,960 --> 01:20:29,000
So there's...
Yeah, there was nowhere better.

1565
01:20:31,000 --> 01:20:33,960
People like that
don't come along very often,

1566
01:20:33,960 --> 01:20:38,960
who established a whole new genre
in entertainment

1567
01:20:38,960 --> 01:20:42,800
which is loved, universally,

1568
01:20:42,800 --> 01:20:44,960
by everybody.

1569
01:20:46,960 --> 01:20:49,960
You know, whenever I'm asked
about Thunderbirds,

1570
01:20:49,960 --> 01:20:51,800
people's eyes light up.

1571
01:20:52,960 --> 01:20:55,960
He didn't deserve
to have such a terrible end.

1572
01:21:03,480 --> 01:21:05,960
When I left Mum's house,

1573
01:21:05,960 --> 01:21:09,960
I set off on a journey
of several hundred miles

1574
01:21:09,960 --> 01:21:13,960
to come to a place that...

1575
01:21:13,960 --> 01:21:16,640
has become more and more apparent

1576
01:21:16,640 --> 01:21:20,960
that is the site
of so much of Dad's inspiration.

1577
01:21:20,960 --> 01:21:25,960
It's the place
where one incident happened

1578
01:21:25,960 --> 01:21:28,960
that changed his life forever

1579
01:21:28,960 --> 01:21:31,960
and set him on a path of creation,

1580
01:21:31,960 --> 01:21:33,960
trying to become a success,

1581
01:21:33,960 --> 01:21:36,960
trying to make something
of his life.

1582
01:21:36,960 --> 01:21:41,960
And after many, many hundreds
of miles, and many hours of driving,

1583
01:21:41,960 --> 01:21:44,960
we are about to arrive...

1584
01:21:44,960 --> 01:21:47,960
at that place,
in Arnhem, in the Netherlands.

1585
01:22:19,480 --> 01:22:21,960
"The Queen and I offer you
our heartfelt sympathy

1586
01:22:21,960 --> 01:22:23,960
"in your great sorrow.

1587
01:22:23,960 --> 01:22:27,960
"We pray that your country's
gratitude for a life so nobly given

1588
01:22:27,960 --> 01:22:30,960
"in its service may bring you
some measure of consolation."

1589
01:22:33,960 --> 01:22:35,960
But I suspect that was
of little comfort to them.

1590
01:22:38,960 --> 01:22:43,960
I started this journey not really
fully understanding Dad. Erm...

1591
01:22:43,960 --> 01:22:45,960
Understanding some things about him

1592
01:22:45,960 --> 01:22:48,960
and feeling like I had an inkling
of what motivated him

1593
01:22:48,960 --> 01:22:51,960
and why he did what he did
and why he behaved the way he did.

1594
01:22:51,960 --> 01:22:54,640
If it wasn't for Lionel
first asking that question

1595
01:22:54,640 --> 01:22:56,960
about what's at
the edge of the universe,

1596
01:22:56,960 --> 01:22:59,960
and it wasn't for
his time in Light Rescue,

1597
01:22:59,960 --> 01:23:01,960
his time as a hero pilot,

1598
01:23:01,960 --> 01:23:04,960
a template for nearly every
leading character in Dad's shows,

1599
01:23:04,960 --> 01:23:07,960
and without Lionel's
brush with Hollywood,

1600
01:23:07,960 --> 01:23:10,960
then Dad's life might've
taken a very different path.

1601
01:23:11,960 --> 01:23:16,640
But really, I think nothing
affected him more in Lionel's life

1602
01:23:16,640 --> 01:23:17,960
than Lionel's death.

1603
01:23:19,800 --> 01:23:20,960
Not only did his death inspire him

1604
01:23:20,960 --> 01:23:26,480
to create utopian worlds that
were devoid of religion and war,

1605
01:23:26,480 --> 01:23:29,960
Lionel was an idol
that he tried to live up to,

1606
01:23:29,960 --> 01:23:31,960
but he never felt that he succeeded.

1607
01:23:31,960 --> 01:23:36,960
But I think it instilled in him
the need to be successful

1608
01:23:36,960 --> 01:23:39,320
and to try and make his parents
proud of him.

1609
01:23:40,960 --> 01:23:42,960
That's in spite of Debbie
telling him

1610
01:23:42,960 --> 01:23:45,160
that he should've been killed
instead of his brother.

1611
01:23:46,960 --> 01:23:49,800
Dad would've done anything
to make his parents proud,

1612
01:23:49,800 --> 01:23:52,960
even though it was most likely
their dysfunctional marriage

1613
01:23:52,960 --> 01:23:55,960
that led him to being
unable to deal with conflicts,

1614
01:23:55,960 --> 01:23:57,960
be they professional or personal.

1615
01:23:59,480 --> 01:24:01,960
His parents' failings would see Dad

1616
01:24:01,960 --> 01:24:04,960
try to create
his perfect childhood on screen,

1617
01:24:04,960 --> 01:24:09,960
filled with money
and toys and gadgets.

1618
01:24:09,960 --> 01:24:12,960
But no mothers
and only strong fathers.

1619
01:24:13,960 --> 01:24:17,480
Without all these
hidden childhood influences,

1620
01:24:17,480 --> 01:24:20,960
his creations would
likely never have existed.

1621
01:24:21,960 --> 01:24:25,000
So having started this journey
not really...

1622
01:24:25,000 --> 01:24:26,960
knowing Dad at all...

1623
01:24:28,960 --> 01:24:31,960
..I feel like I can now say
that I, I do know him.

1624
01:24:33,960 --> 01:24:35,960
Possibly better
than he knew himself.

1625
01:24:54,960 --> 01:24:56,960
So, here...

1626
01:24:56,960 --> 01:25:00,960
at the final resting place
of the most influential figure

1627
01:25:00,960 --> 01:25:02,960
in Dad's life...

1628
01:25:02,960 --> 01:25:05,960
is the best place
for my journey of discovery

1629
01:25:05,960 --> 01:25:07,960
to come to an end.

1630
01:25:10,960 --> 01:25:11,960
I don't think
I've got the kind of mind

1631
01:25:11,960 --> 01:25:13,960
that worries about being remembered.

1632
01:25:13,960 --> 01:25:17,960
But I suppose I'd like to think
people said that he was a nice guy,

1633
01:25:17,960 --> 01:25:20,960
and I think I would like
people to say that

1634
01:25:20,960 --> 01:25:24,960
he was a very responsible person
with the films that he made.

1635
01:25:24,960 --> 01:25:28,960
That he did not encourage people
to shoot Grandma through the head,

1636
01:25:28,960 --> 01:25:30,960
and didn't encourage drug-taking,

1637
01:25:30,960 --> 01:25:33,960
and hopefully brought
a lot of good quality,

1638
01:25:33,960 --> 01:25:35,960
wholesome entertainment for kids.

1639
01:25:35,960 --> 01:25:37,960
I had a friend
who would describe somebody

1640
01:25:37,960 --> 01:25:39,960
and say,
"He was a very human being."

1641
01:25:39,960 --> 01:25:40,960
I think it's nice,

1642
01:25:40,960 --> 01:25:43,800
and perhaps that's something
I'd like to be described as.

1643
01:25:59,960 --> 01:26:03,000
If you could say anything
to Gerry today,

1644
01:26:03,000 --> 01:26:04,960
what would you say?

1645
01:26:08,480 --> 01:26:09,960
HE SNIFFLES

1646
01:26:13,960 --> 01:26:15,960
I just...

1647
01:26:15,960 --> 01:26:17,960
HE SNIFFLES

1648
01:26:18,960 --> 01:26:21,960
Erm...

1649
01:26:21,960 --> 01:26:22,960
Gosh.

1650
01:26:24,960 --> 01:26:26,960
What would I say?

1651
01:26:26,960 --> 01:26:29,320
I'd have just wanted to say
"Thank you" to him.

1652
01:26:29,320 --> 01:26:30,960
"Thank you for the excitement."

1653
01:26:30,960 --> 01:26:34,800
I think simply
that he was appreciated.

1654
01:26:35,960 --> 01:26:37,960
I'm really glad
that you met somebody

1655
01:26:37,960 --> 01:26:41,960
that you were able to be happy with
for the rest of your life.

1656
01:26:41,960 --> 01:26:43,960
I'd want him to know that...

1657
01:26:43,960 --> 01:26:44,960
Oh, God. Stop it.

1658
01:26:54,960 --> 01:26:57,640
I want him to know that
I forgive him for everything.

1659
01:26:57,640 --> 01:27:01,160
And I think just that he should've
been beyond satisfied

1660
01:27:01,160 --> 01:27:02,960
with his success.

1661
01:27:02,960 --> 01:27:06,800
A big, loud, roaring "thank you".

1662
01:27:10,640 --> 01:27:13,960
Er, I'm not the only one that cried
on the day he died, I'm sure.

1663
01:27:15,960 --> 01:27:19,960
Well, we did nearly,
just over 30 years married,

1664
01:27:19,960 --> 01:27:21,960
and they said it would never last.

1665
01:27:21,960 --> 01:27:24,960
There we are, proved them wrong.
SHE CHUCKLES

1666
01:27:31,320 --> 01:27:34,480
Subtitles by accessibility@itv.com